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Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:11 AM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:13 AM
You shouldn't be able to Blow hard either but you do. Nah just messing. Your name leaves it wide open. Perhaps you have just made a very good build. Are you pure ice or do you have other abilities from other trees?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:19 AM
You shouldn't be able to Blow hard either but you do. Nah just messing. Your name leaves it wide open. Perhaps you have just made a very good build. Are you pure ice or do you have other abilities from other trees?

Just Ice, with regen. Use primarily Ice Wall and Snowstorm with an occassional Ice Blast to finish things off. It seems strange that I can even hurt them, let alone easily kill them.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:22 AM
Just Ice, with regen. Use primarily Ice Wall and Snowstorm with an occassional Ice Blast to finish things off. It seems strange that I can even hurt them, let alone easily kill them.

Congratulations! You're one of the few who have realized how to properly play the game. It's not that we shouldn't be able to do these things, it's that people, in general, are dumb and can't figure out how to do it properly, so they complain.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:23 AM
The power difference between levels isn't huge, that's all...particularly by 28 when you'll have your key powers in place with the most important advantages set up.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:28 AM
Just tested out more 41 Henchman, and ranged guys are much more difficult, but still doable. I wish I could get higher level quests. I enjoy the challenge.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:33 AM
I have Ice(down below) without Regen and it's been pretty easy so far as well.

Every patch I keep thinking "They are going to nerf this stuff watch."

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:33 AM
Just tested out more 41 Henchman, and ranged guys are much more difficult, but still doable. I wish I could get higher level quests. I enjoy the challenge.

That's how I felt with my fire character in closed beta, granted powers were stronger then, but at 27 I went to Monster Island and was fighting level 36+ enemies just for the challenge, and that was with Fire Form. It's a lot of fun when you can pull stuff like that off.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:35 AM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Nothing in this game really makes sense, sometimes you got to ask youself "what were the devs thinking" ?:o

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:36 AM
Just tested out more 41 Henchman, and ranged guys are much more difficult, but still doable. I wish I could get higher level quests. I enjoy the challenge.

You can always create a challenge. Drop all your 9 boost powers. Pick other powers. You can get any challenge you like by how you want to build your char.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:38 AM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Level doesn't make quite as huge of a difference in this game as some. Stuff that far over your level is going to be harder to kill and hit harder, but stuff that is 5+ levels under you can also still kill you if there's enough of them. You just happen to have a good play style, good skill and a good build.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:39 AM
Um trust me on this, Regen sucks at high level with Ice stats Dex and End or Rec. You'll get one shot by legendary npcs and anything more than a couple of even con mobs will own you too.

Try reading this passive defense guide (http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=46096&highlight=Defensive+Passive+Guide), which probably explains more than i ever could.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:40 AM
You can always create a challenge. Drop all your 9 boost powers. Pick other powers. You can get any challenge you like by how you want to build your char.

I've always loved Ice. Had a level 80 Ice Mage in WOW. Ice in CO is tough though, since there aren't any new powers available from 17 to now. No real way to change the build, other than leaving regen out. I wish they did give me more power options, since I've been using the Ice Wall/Snowstorm combo since level 14.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:41 AM
Um trust me on this, Regen sucks at high level with Ice stats Dex and End or Rec. You'll get one shot by legendary npcs and anything more than a couple of even con mobs will own you too.

Try reading this passive defense guide (http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=46096&highlight=Defensive+Passive+Guide), which probably explains more than i ever could.

sure, if you took the recommended stats for ice, but if you're not taking ice form, those stats don't do any good. if you take Constitution and Recovery for example, Regen will be a beast. I've tanked every legendary so far with regen, and I don't even have a recovery build. I'm str/con.


edit: except the big two in Monster Island, no one ever wants to do them for some reason.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:44 AM
Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Should happen, with skill and a strong build.

This game does not arbitrarily weaken or strengthen players/NPC's based on an out of character concept such as level range.

On the same token, those grey low level enemies can still hit and damage you just the same.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:44 AM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

They made the game so that it really doesn't matter if you can do this.

XP rewards cap at 5 levels over your own, so if you are level 28, a level 33 henchman and a level 41 henchman both give you exactly the same amount of XP per kill.

The game scales damage against higher and lower level opponents this way to help promote grouping. This way if you team up with your level 32 friend vs. his level 34 opponents you are able to contribute significantly as opposed to other games where against a higher level enemy your damage would essentially be pointless.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:45 AM
Um trust me on this, Regen sucks at high level with Ice stats Dex and End or Rec. You'll get one shot by legendary npcs and anything more than a couple of even con mobs will own you too.

Try reading this passive defense guide (http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=46096&highlight=Defensive+Passive+Guide), which probably explains more than i ever could.

Regen does seem to be the key at this point. Although I can kill level 41 melee guys pretty easily, the majority of the fights require some blocking heal time. I'll take a look at that guide, since regen would be useless if you're getting one or two shot end game.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:45 AM
Um trust me on this, Regen sucks at high level with Ice stats Dex and End or Rec. You'll get one shot by legendary npcs and anything more than a couple of even con mobs will own you too.

Try reading this passive defense guide (http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=46096&highlight=Defensive+Passive+Guide), which probably explains more than i ever could.

That guide is largely incorrect. It also lacks alot of details that are important. For instance, if the incoming damage is below the damage threshold for invuln, you take 0 damage, not 1. Secondly, Regen doesn't scale off presence, it scales off Recovery, and regen isn't based off your maximum health. However, Con is still a great stat for regen, since Resurgence does scale to it, and more health means you take longer to kill and your regen has more time to do it's thing.

Also I wouldn't suggest regen to someone that is new and/or doesn't like blocking, I'd suggest con superstatted invuln to that person. Because, regen, while able to recover from damage well, takes everything to the face. But really, if you don't want to block, this isn't the game for you.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:47 AM
Regen does seem to be the key at this point. Although I can kill level 41 melee guys pretty easily, the majority of the fights require some blocking heal time. I'll take a look at that guide, since regen would be useless if you're getting one or two shot end game.

If you don't block it doesn't matter what passive you have. You will die hehe.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:48 AM
I've always loved Ice. Had a level 80 Ice Mage in WOW. Ice in CO is tough though, since there aren't any new powers available from 17 to now. No real way to change the build, other than leaving regen out. I wish they did give me more power options, since I've been using the Ice Wall/Snowstorm combo since level 14.

Take out your 9 powers then. It will be nerfed just not today, patience. But talk about a brick wall. "I always loved ice", ok well perhaps I should be ****** Man. No other weaker Ice Powers? Drop Regen?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:48 AM
They made the game so that it really doesn't matter if you can do this.

XP rewards cap at 5 levels over your own, so if you are level 28, a level 33 henchman and a level 41 henchman both give you exactly the same amount of XP per kill.

The game scales damage against higher and lower level opponents this way to help promote grouping. This way if you team up with your level 32 friend vs. his level 34 opponents you are able to contribute significantly as opposed to other games where against a higher level enemy your damage would essentially be pointless.

I understand, but I guess my point is, where does the challenge come from when I'm 40?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:50 AM
Take out your 9 powers then. It will be nerfed just not today, patience. But talk about a brick wall. "I always loved ice", ok well perhaps I should be ****** Man. No other weaker Ice Powers? Drop Regen?

Please, tell me who your supplier is. You seem to be on some great spice and I could use some.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:52 AM
I understand, but I guess my point is, where does the challenge come from when I'm 40?

If you're looking for a game where every encounter has a high probability of death, I'd suggest you look elsewhere, this is a super hero game.

Barring that, make a weaker build and pull lots of mobs onto you when you fight.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:53 AM
You can always create a challenge. Drop all your 9 boost powers. Pick other powers. You can get any challenge you like by how you want to build your char.

Why is it up to him to figure out a way to create a challenge? Sounds like he already built the character the way he wants, so it's a failing of the game to provide the challenge he's looking for. Sure, one build might be much better than the other, but if he can take out 41s with little issue at 28, how fun is it going to be at 35 or especially 40 for him to play what he wants to play?

I get that it's a superhero game and people don't want to feel like henchman can take you out, but there's different "types" of henchman in the comics as well. The Penguin's thugs and robots under Brainiac's control are vastly different in scope - I think that's what's missing here. A level 28 hero should pose little to no threat to a level 41, regardless of classification as henchman, villain, etc. I could see things scaling so that a group of 5 might have a chance - that would give us the reason to team that we're missing right now as well.

I don't see how it's acceptable that, even with a great build and a great playstyle, people should be able to blow through content that's technically 13-14 levels above them. Is that possible in any other game, an MMO in particular? This would explain why so many people were 40 in the first week - by the time they hit high 20s, things just got easier, not harder.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:57 AM
If you're looking for a game where every encounter has a high probability of death, I'd suggest you look elsewhere, this is a super hero game.

Barring that, make a weaker build and pull lots of mobs onto you when you fight.

What the heck kind of commentary is this? People basically saying the only way to get a challenge is to purposely gimp yourself?

Nobody said anything about a high probability of death - we're talking challenge. OP is asking if there is one at later levels and, from the responses, the answer sounds like no, unless you're willing to play something you don't want to play (unless that's Hodgepodge, who has only Energy Builders from each power set).

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:58 AM
If you're looking for a game where every encounter has a high probability of death, I'd suggest you look elsewhere, this is a super hero game.

Barring that, make a weaker build and pull lots of mobs onto you when you fight.

I don't want to die, but really, I could do what I'm doing with 4 powers: Regen, Ice Block, Ice Wall and Snowstorm. I could use some mobs that are Ice resistant. That would be nice.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 10:59 AM
Why is it up to him to figure out a way to create a challenge? Sounds like he already built the character the way he wants, so it's a failing of the game to provide the challenge he's looking for. Sure, one build might be much better than the other, but if he can take out 41s with little issue at 28, how fun is it going to be at 35 or especially 40 for him to play what he wants to play?

Challanged obsessed people need to stop trying to get this game made harder and get some difficulty settings implemented. Even *I* want that. Possibly more than anything.

I get that it's a superhero game and people don't want to feel like henchman can take you out, but there's different "types" of henchman in the comics as well. The Penguin's thugs and robots under Brainiac's control are vastly different in scope - I think that's what's missing here. A level 28 hero should pose little to no threat to a level 41, regardless of classification as henchman, villain, etc. I could see things scaling so that a group of 5 might have a chance - that would give us the reason to team that we're missing right now as well.

And to some extent, you see that. Demon and Gadroon Henchmen are substantially more dangerous than VIPER for instance. Also, alot of times the difference you're talking about is the difference between a henchmen, and a villain class enemy.

I don't see how it's acceptable that, even with a great build and a great playstyle, people should be able to blow through content that's technically 13-14 levels above them. Is that possible in any other game, an MMO in particular? This would explain why so many people were 40 in the first week - by the time they hit high 20s, things just got easier, not harder.

Making things harder isn't going to slow powergamers down because they will just find more powerful builds and better ways to cheat the system. It's acceptable, because, with a level cap on how far ahead stuff will give you XP, it doesn't matter. Not everyone has a build that can do that, and if you nerf the game trying to gimp these people, you're going to cause a large amount of people that didn't have these uber builds or didn't care for them to require them, and they will quit on you.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:02 AM
What the heck kind of commentary is this? People basically saying the only way to get a challenge is to purposely gimp yourself?

Nobody said anything about a high probability of death - we're talking challenge. OP is asking if there is one at later levels and, from the responses, the answer sounds like no, unless you're willing to play something you don't want to play (unless that's Hodgepodge, who has only Energy Builders from each power set).

*Waves hand* This is not the game you are looking for.

But no, seriously, ask for difficulty settings. I've been trying to get people to do this for a while now, if it gets enough support it will happen.

Also, one persons challenge is another persons death trap. Better to make things easy by default and let the player raise the challenge, lest you get people rage quitting on you.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:03 AM
Difficulty slider would be great and a cool option, but would only impact instances. Stiil, it would provide more challenge based on personal choice.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:06 AM
Difficulty slider would be great and a cool option, but would only impact instances. Stiil, it would provide more challenge based on personal choice.

I'm not sure of that. With a bit of changes to the underlying system you might be able to make outdoor mobs scale per player, or maybe have some of the outdoor instances scale up in challenge (the WHOLE GAME is instanced, you know). I'd rather go for option A because that means super hardcore powergamer with godlike build A can team with average joe weekend action gamer with a regular middle of the line theme build and have their own level of challenge.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:08 AM
Its got nothing to do with regen, its that, as stated, the game does not penalize you or give bonuses based on level difference. In any other MMO, the only reason why you wouldn't be able to kill something 7 levels higher isn't because of stats, its because its artificially difficult in that none of your hits land.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:10 AM
Its got nothing to do with regen, its that, as stated, the game does not penalize you or give bonuses based on level difference. In any other MMO, the only reason why you wouldn't be able to kill something 7 levels higher isn't because of stats, its because its artificially difficult in that none of your hits land.

That is true to an extent, but if you take, say, a Lightning Reflexes or something with an Offensive Passive up against +7s you're going to die from a couple of henchmen unless you're really, really, really careful. But, like I said, it doesn't matter, you can't get XP from stuff that high over your level.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:19 AM
So are you thinking maybe shards could be spawned with certain challenge levels in mind, and assign you based on your choice? That might have some promise - if I knew something like that was in the works, I'd pace my play a little differently. I was very happy when COX put the difficulty sliders in for missions, since it gave everyone the opportunity to customize the challenge they wanted.

Believe me, if people like the game the way it is, I wouldn't want Cryptic to do anything to impact that. However, there are people who expected more challenge too, so it would be great to find a way to please both. Nobody's going to complain about a bigger, more stable sub base.

I guess part of my feeling on this is that you don't hit team-oriented stuff (except for Open Missions, which I like when they're working) until you're almost 3/4 of the way through leveling. If there were more challenges, even if team-oriented, earlier on, I don't think this would be as much of a concern of mine.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:21 AM
Given that the were just getting over the backlash of 2 considerable nerfs, think, do you REALLY want to be posting that your toon is overpowered. Just don't come crying if you get whacked with the nerf-bat.

Tweaking the balance of a game is like getting the right shower temperature with a mixer tap: one minute it's scalding, the next it's freezing your nads off. Trouble is when you find your own just right, you know the next person's gonna mess with the dial....

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:24 AM
Just Ice, with regen. Use primarily Ice Wall and Snowstorm with an occassional Ice Blast to finish things off. It seems strange that I can even hurt them, let alone easily kill them.

This isn't WoW. Check the list of "features" on the game. It says "Brains Required". You shouldn't be surprised when your own player skill trumps your character's skill. Rather than complaining, rejoice that you meet the "Brains Required" part.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:41 AM
*Waves hand* This is not the game you are looking for.

But no, seriously, ask for difficulty settings. I've been trying to get people to do this for a while now, if it gets enough support it will happen.

Also, one persons challenge is another persons death trap. Better to make things easy by default and let the player raise the challenge, lest you get people rage quitting on you.

I know they can't make the game more challenging or difficult. People were losing their minds over the past changes. Personally though, I need more of a challenge, and maybe the way to do that is with "shard" difficulty levels. Have shards available that make the mobs scale +2., +4, +6 of normal.. Make all drops "sidekick" to the appropriate level so I can use them, and everyone gets the challenge they want, and there is no advantage or disadvantage that would make others complain.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:48 AM
This isn't WoW. Check the list of "features" on the game. It says "Brains Required". You shouldn't be surprised when your own player skill trumps your character's skill. Rather than complaining, rejoice that you meet the "Brains Required" part.

Why is every thread that isn't titled "Woo Hoo I love this game" classified as a "complaint" ? This is more of a concern, and a justified one becasue if I can kill most things in game at 28, there will be no challenge and no reason to group later on. And I have a standard Ice build, no FoTM and nothing special. I may know how to play the game, but that doesn't mean I don't deserve to enjoy it.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:50 AM
Why is every thread that isn't titled "Woo Hoo I love this game" classified as a "complaint"?

"I shouldn't be able to do this" and then talking about how you can. That is actually, technically a complaint. Dictionary definition even. Also, congradulation for using hyperbole against someone who was complimenting you for playing the game properly. Remind me not to compliment you again.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 11:56 AM
We are supposed to be SUPER HEROES right?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 12:03 PM
"I shouldn't be able to do this" and then talking about how you can. That is actually, technically a complaint. Dictionary definition even. Also, congradulation for using hyperbole against someone who was complimenting you for playing the game properly. Remind me not to compliment you again.

Semantics aside, I wasn't criticizing you. Just pointing out that the game shouldn't be catering to the lowest common denominator.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 12:32 PM
We are supposed to be SUPER HEROES right?

I will certainly agree we're supposed to be superheroes, yes. But there are different types - immensely powerful ones like Superman, and those like Daredevil or Punisher. What each finds a challenge is vastly different.

I'm not sure what your point is. Are you trying to say that any superhero should have a chance to be able to take out anything, regardless of who/what they are (in game terms, power set and level)? If that's the case, why bother with levels at all? Just fill the game with stuff that we can take out right from the start, some a little more challenging than others, but most stuff soloable. Hit buttons, gather stuff, done.

Sounds fun...

The folks looking for a challenge are not saying nerf stuff to make it harder. They're asking for more challenging content, ideally some solo.

I can't see why anyone would be against the ability to, for example, give an individual a way to customize their experience to be more challenging. Difficulty sliders for instanced missions, shards that spawn at varied higher levels as indicated in another post (but loot given out as if sidekicked - i.e. your real level), and other things.

When it comes down to it, it's a game. First and foremost it need to be fun. For some people, that's blowing through stuff without much of a challenge, for others that challenge in an MMO IS the fun. The game seems to meet the needs of the first group, so why not try a few things to appeal to the other group? No reason they can't try and add (not change, necessarily) some stuff to appeal to both. More subs is more subs. If the content remains too easy, unless they HUGELY increase the re-playability of the game by adding oodles of more content quickly, many players will have a much shorter subscription length than for most MMOs.

And I'm not here on the boards because I don't like the game - I'd have cancelled if I felt that strongly. I don't get why many of those responding are acting like people with constructive criticism are the enemy.
Is there some reason why people wouldn't be open to some more challenging solo or team-oriented content, as long as it was ADDED vs. changing the existing content for all players?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 12:35 PM
Funny, the last I heard Ice was unplayable. I did think they were exaggerating when they said so, but I had no idea Ice was so powerful.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 12:46 PM
Regen has it's weaknesses, you'll notice later on. Sudden heavy damage means your HP pool goes straight down to zero, whereas other characters with say Invulnerability can withstand the damage.

Yes, Regen is amazing for leveling. It's not overpowered in the higher levels.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 12:56 PM
That guide is largely incorrect. It also lacks alot of details that are important. For instance, if the incoming damage is below the damage threshold for invuln, you take 0 damage, not 1. Secondly, Regen doesn't scale off presence, it scales off Recovery, and regen isn't based off your maximum health. However, Con is still a great stat for regen, since Resurgence does scale to it, and more health means you take longer to kill and your regen has more time to do it's thing.

Also I wouldn't suggest regen to someone that is new and/or doesn't like blocking, I'd suggest con superstatted invuln to that person. Because, regen, while able to recover from damage well, takes everything to the face. But really, if you don't want to block, this isn't the game for you.


Well if what you say it true, this would mean i have good experience of regen with a Dex/REC build i was using a little while back.


Regen stopped crit'n a few patches ago during the passive defense nerfs and now that i have hit the 38+ region, i have really noticed regen's lackluster performance, versus hard hitting mobs.

I switched to some mitigation defense pasive and some active defenses instead, which seem to work better for now, until they get nerfed too probably.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 01:07 PM
Funny, the last I heard Ice was unplayable. I did think they were exaggerating when they said so, but I had no idea Ice was so powerful.

I haven't noticed any difference, but I didn't have or use the abilities that took the biggest hits. Chill was supposedly changed, but again, I haven't noticed. Maybe folks are complaining about it from a PVP standpoint.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 02:36 PM
I notice this thread also kinda glosses over the whole achiever mentality part.

Even if it's made harder we'll just see a thread of how a duo of a tank/dps spec and healer spec can wade through anything they come up against and it's too easy blah blah blah.

Things are still being dialed in and still need just a bit of tweaking, but already as an Ice build you have regen....which I guess if I spent a few mins I could come up with a backstory based reason that you heal up from incoming damage, but at first thought it really doesn't make sense.

I could see invuln on an ice build maybe, or even FF as you have an ice shell that would make you a bit ballistic and force proof and an aura of cold that would lessen any incoming heat based laser/plasma like attack maybe.

Let's face it, liberal writing could explain about any build you want to have, but if you are starting from an achiever mindset where you want to win more than a concept mindset, you are probably going to win.

I have a munitions character that was exposed to something(unknown) while on a LEAF search and rescue mission, hence the character name..."LEAF search and rescue" :)

Listed as now having greater strength, agility, and endurance from the unknown exposure I have personal FF for the endurance part to add to the survivability, but the second I take a FF bubble Hold enemy power I'm way off my concept. I could of course go in and write how my character found or was given the tech, but let's face it I'm just giving up the concept because the achiever in me doesn't want the challenge, and it's so easy and tempting to fill that weakness gap that the original concept left.

This game is made so people can make their concept characters and play them. A bit of writing to get a totally crazy, they'd never survive character concept viable is one thing, but if you are just an achiever in the land of concept characters, don't expect to feel gimped.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 02:39 PM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Regen with anything is way too easy, PvE or PvP. It needs to be scaled back.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 03:13 PM
I notice this thread also kinda glosses over the whole achiever mentality part.

Even if it's made harder we'll just see a thread of how a duo of a tank/dps spec and healer spec can wade through anything they come up against and it's too easy blah blah blah.

Things are still being dialed in and still need just a bit of tweaking, but already as an Ice build you have regen....which I guess if I spent a few mins I could come up with a backstory based reason that you heal up from incoming damage, but at first thought it really doesn't make sense.

I could see invuln on an ice build maybe, or even FF as you have an ice shell that would make you a bit ballistic and force proof and an aura of cold that would lessen any incoming heat based laser/plasma like attack maybe.

Let's face it, liberal writing could explain about any build you want to have, but if you are starting from an achiever mindset where you want to win more than a concept mindset, you are probably going to win.

I have a munitions character that was exposed to something(unknown) while on a LEAF search and rescue mission, hence the character name..."LEAF search and rescue" :)

Listed as now having greater strength, agility, and endurance from the unknown exposure I have personal FF for the endurance part to add to the survivability, but the second I take a FF bubble Hold enemy power I'm way off my concept. I could of course go in and write how my character found or was given the tech, but let's face it I'm just giving up the concept because the achiever in me doesn't want the challenge, and it's so easy and tempting to fill that weakness gap that the original concept left.

This game is made so people can make their concept characters and play them. A bit of writing to get a totally crazy, they'd never survive character concept viable is one thing, but if you are just an achiever in the land of concept characters, don't expect to feel gimped.



I'm a frozen yogurt saleman that was sealed in his truck by a Qulaar energy beam, and was forced to eat radioactive frozen yogurt to survive. He was going to be 100% Ice, but this game seemed to require a passive defense. Conceptually, none made any sense, but I went regen becasue I was stacking recovery and it's a complimentary stat. This was before the passives got nerfed, so they were all considered overpowered. I certainly didn't go for the best build either, since what I've read says Snowstorm is a waste and it's my primary attack and I didn't even take Shatter until last power.

I didn't start this thread to say the game was too easy, although I believe it is. I was just surprised, and quite frankly, a little disgusted, that I could kill max level villians. Just didn't seem right.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 03:35 PM
I'm a frozen yogurt saleman that was sealed in his truck by a Qulaar energy beam, and was forced to eat radioactive frozen yogurt to survive. He was going to be 100% Ice, but this game seemed to require a passive defense. Conceptually, none made any sense, but I went regen becasue I was stacking recovery and it's a complimentary stat. This was before the passives got nerfed, so they were all considered overpowered. I certainly didn't go for the best build either, since what I've read says Snowstorm is a waste and it's my primary attack and I didn't even take Shatter until last power.

I didn't start this thread to say the game was too easy, although I believe it is. I was just surprised, and quite frankly, a little disgusted, that I could kill max level villians. Just didn't seem right.

So you chose a passive defense which is known to be pretty strong for soloing in order to make the game easier for yourself, and you're surprised it's easy?

The game doesn't ''require'' a passive defense, having a passive defense just makes it easier in a lot of cases.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 03:44 PM
The OP is right, he shouldnt be able to do that!!!! Just like people shouldnt be able to solo 5 man instances!! I can not believe what I am reading in this thread.. People are trying to justify the broken mess that is CO... Devs is that what you want? People thinking you should be able to solo mobs 15+ levels above your level? You release a broken game and now everyone will cry if you fix it... You did the same thing with CoH... GG

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 03:52 PM
So you chose a passive defense which is known to be pretty strong for soloing in order to make the game easier for yourself, and you're surprised it's easy?

The game doesn't ''require'' a passive defense, having a passive defense just makes it easier in a lot of cases.

As I mentioned, I chose regen in open beta when all of the defensive passives seemed strong, and there was no estabished must have power yet. I also didn't choose it for the in fight benefits as much as I did so I could recover quickly for the next fight.

Again, my point is not to nerf or buff any power but simply to ask, should we be able to kill Villians 15 levels above us? Regen is only a small factor in that discussion.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 03:55 PM
Level 28 Ice guy with regen. I can easily take out 4 level 36 henchman, 3 level 41 henchman, a level 36 Villain and 2 36 henchman, and I just killed a level 41 Villian with full health remaining. Shouldn't happen. Just saying.

Why the hell not? you are a super hero after all.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:07 PM
Why the hell not? you are a super hero after all.

Does that mean I should be able to come out of the tutorial and kill Grond? I can not understand why anyone would want to play a game where the outcome was predetermined.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:10 PM
Does that mean I should be able to come out of the tutorial and kill Grond? I can not understand why anyone would want to play a game where the outcome was predetermined.

It's not predetermined, and you can't kill grond right out of the tutorial.

Just look at the masses of people who've been crying everything is to hard.

Congratulations you've joined the ranks of people who aren't effing morons and can play the game well, lets not try to nerf it into oblivion because you, myself and others don't terribly suck at it.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:16 PM
I have Ice(down below)

You should see a doctor about that. Also consider a hot bath.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:19 PM
It's not predetermined, and you can't kill grond right out of the tutorial.

Just look at the masses of people who've been crying everything is to hard.

Congratulations you've joined the ranks of people who aren't effing morons and can play the game well, lets not try to nerf it into oblivion because you, myself and others don't terribly suck at it.

How about the devs fix the game and not have broken powers just because you want to pwn mobs 15+ levels above you...

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:20 PM
I can not understand why anyone would want to play a game where the outcome was predetermined.

Because it's fun?

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:21 PM
It's not predetermined, and you can't kill grond right out of the tutorial.

Just look at the masses of people who've been crying everything is to hard.

Congratulations you've joined the ranks of people who aren't effing morons and can play the game well, lets not try to nerf it into oblivion because you, myself and others don't terribly suck at it.

I don't think I'm all that skilled, but if killings most mobs at 28 will be possible, they should open the game up and remove arbitrary level restrictions. Even though I can kill the mobs in MI, I don't have access to any of the quests. I know there needs to be a ton more content to make an open world work, but what the heck. If I want to give it a shot 10 levels early, I should be able to. They would just have to restrict sidekicking to some degree.

I say stop nerfing and buffing powers and allow an open game world to dictate what people choose to do with their powersets given strengths/weaknesses.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:24 PM
Because it's fun?

If you find it fun , more power to you. But I don't think it's the way to keep people around and paying $15 a month.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:48 PM
I understand, but I guess my point is, where does the challenge come from when I'm 40?

5 man content, *tough* enemies, Master and Super Villains, PvP and whatever other content they may add once the cap is pushed up to 50th.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:52 PM
Does that mean I should be able to come out of the tutorial and kill Grond?

Please feel free to try. I'd love to watch.

:D

Seriously, measuring how "powerful" you are by being able to kill henchmen at various levels is not accurate at all.

Henchmen are supposed to be easy to take down. Try taking out a level 40 Master Villain at 28 solo and you'll rethink your opinion of just how strong you are.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:54 PM
Why is it up to him to figure out a way to create a challenge?

Well hello? That is why I said patience. It will get nerfed. I mean like what else is a reasonable man who is dominating and has no control of code going to do? I think my option is THEE only option today. FWIW I do that a ton with RPG's. You can maximize yourself right out of good game play in a lot of games. I agree it would be great if one didn't have to, but again I'm working with the reality of today. If one is truly looking for a challenge and feels too strong now, downgrade yourself while you wait. Or quit. Or live with being dominant.

A balanced game to one person is someone else easy or someone elses impossible. So imo if you are wanting a challenging game, you balance yourself ultimately to the way you want the game to be played.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 04:55 PM
Please, tell me who your supplier is. You seem to be on some great spice and I could use some.

Well at least I'm not in love with Ice so much I can't be anything other then Ice. I guess there is one of everybody out there.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 05:00 PM
Well hello? That is why I said patience. It will get nerfed. I mean like what else is a reasonable man who is dominating and has no control of code going to do? I think my option is THEE only option today. FWIW I do that a ton with RPG's. You can maximize yourself right out of good game play in a lot of games. I agree it would be great if one didn't have to, but again I'm working with the reality of today. If one is truly looking for a challenge and feels too strong now, downgrade yourself while you wait. Or quit. Or live with being dominant.

I agree with you. Purposely gimping myself is an option. I may go to build 2 and leave off or downgrade the enhancements and see what happens. It's easier than retconing.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 05:03 PM
Well at least I'm not in love with Ice so much I can't be anything other then Ice. I guess there is one of everybody out there.

I have a buch of alts too, but the Ice guy is my highest and I'd rather see new content than rehash old stuff. Since it's a concept character, changing power sets just wouldn't work.

Archived Post
10-03-2009, 06:54 PM
Please feel free to try. I'd love to watch.

:D

Seriously, measuring how "powerful" you are by being able to kill henchmen at various levels is not accurate at all.

Henchmen are supposed to be easy to take down. Try taking out a level 40 Master Villain at 28 solo and you'll rethink your opinion of just how strong you are.

I could do it at 32, and can chain-kill them at 34. But I don't believe 'levels' are a very accurate way to determine power except in the broadest sense.