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Archived Post
09-14-2009, 03:50 AM
So I am tinkering my PA build... Here is the build, the comments follow

Build by championBuilder 0.3.2 (http://champions.zarzu.ch)

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: Level 40 Champion

Superstats:
Level 5: Super Endurance
Level 13: Super Intelligence

Powers:
Level 1: Wrist Bolter -- Accelerated Metabolism, Automated Assault
Level 1: Energy Shield -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 5: Laser Sword -- Particle Acceleration, Crippling Challenge
Level 5: Teleport
Level 8: Regeneration -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 11: Mini Gun -- Accelerated Metabolism, Teflon Coated Rounds, Rank 2
Level 14: Micro Munitions -- Accelerated Metabolism, Alpha Strike, Rank 2
Level 17: Chest Beam -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 20: Resurgence
Level 23: Unbreakable
Level 26: Orbital Cannon -- Rank 2, Anvil of Dawn
Level 29: Force Eruption -- Gravitational Polarity
Level 32: Ego Hold
Level 35: Munitions Bots
Level 35: Jet Boots
Level 38: Field Drones



- The idea is to shoot Chest beam for debuff, then run 3 toggles at a time (WB with automated assault, MM and MG). Each toggle got Accelerated Metabolism for more energy. And I SS'ed Endu + Int.
First question, isn't that some sort of overkill ? With this setup, isn't END as a superstat enough to run the toggles properly?

-Second question, if I get to SS int, I'd like to take advantage of it for pets. But what are they worth nowadays ? I'm really unsure about it cos it doesn't fit the concept. If taking CON as a SS instead of INT, that would open two slots for powers. What would you recommend ? I heard Sonic is good when coupled with MG or MM.

- What does fit my concept tho, is minimines tho I am really reluctant to pick it due to OP/nerf concerns. I don't like FOTM. Well I mostly don't like having a nerfbat behind the ears... Might take Particle mine... but I have bad memories from it.

- Laser Sword : looks cool, and is usefull for added dmg (particle acceleration, and mainly, anti block)
Orbital Canon : well I can't see myself not taking it, would it hit for 1 dmg only it's just too cool to pass :D (former GDI player maybe )

- Ego Hold : never had a build without a hold, and that bubble would fit the concept, even if I had to change the colour

- Force Eruption : Fits the energy toon concept, and useful when held

- Some powers I am looking at :
PFF (I am actually rerolling to take regen instead...) but it fitted the concept better :(
Nanobot swarms, for easy survivability mode (Unbreakable + Resurgence without the 30s CD)

- Finally last question, talents and gear: Should I max end (prolly) and then focus on CON ? Int as a third if I go for END/CON as SS ?

Thx in advance for your time for reading, and commenting all of that :p

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 06:27 AM
I like the build, and it's near identical to mine:

Build by championBuilder 0.3.1 (http://champions.zarzu.ch)

Download this Build here. (http://champions.zarzu.ch/download.php?download=4132g60800280821201508405zz0 88082320180830201603500608510706710170672016085206 063027036001503615zz045065075y10e5y2035y2075y20t5y 20k5y20g5y20w25y0035y007eAmerican Ironh0000000000000000)

American Iron: Level 40 Champion

Superstats:
Level 5: Super Intelligence
Level 13: Super Endurance

Powers:
Level 1: Wrist Bolter -- Accelerated Metabolism
Level 1: Concussor Beam -- Accelerated Metabolism, Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 5: Energy Shield
Level 5: Jet Boots
Level 8: Mini Gun -- Accelerated Metabolism, Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 11: Micro Munitions -- Accelerated Metabolism, Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 14: Personal Force Field -- Rank 2
Level 17: Targeting Computer -- Rank 2
Level 20: Munitions Bots -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 23: Field Drones -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 26: Unbreakable -- Rank 2
Level 29: Orbital Cannon -- Anvil of Dawn
Level 32: Protection Field -- Rank 2, Rank 3
Level 35: Containment Field
Level 35: Teleport
Level 38: Resurrection Serum

Talents:
Level 1: Technological Intuition
Level 6: Brilliant
Level 9: Energetic
Level 12: Investigator
Level 15: Accurate
Level 18: Coordinated
Level 21: Daredevil

I'm going with some heal/buff capabilities to use later on.

What is the concept of your character? I'm going for the armor suit wearing weapons expert/procurer. Sort of a Tony Stark meets Frank Castle meets Steve Rogers kind of amalgam.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 10:06 AM
Mine would be closer to Samus aran :D
That's why I hardly see the bots fit in... and I need a mine ! lol

I might pick power gauntlet for pure concept reasons

So I guess you're gonna toggle CB+MM+MG. Do you think your end/int will sustain it ? 3 toggles at a time seems much, I wonder if you can hold that more than 2 secs lol

I have had bad experience with PFF, tho I agree it fits the concept better. Regen could fit mine, as there was a special feature with a super bomb to make Samus aran regen lol

I wouldn't recommend targetting computer. There are passives better suited for energy generation. Can't remember which one but I now for sure it has been discussed in a thread around.

Also you didn't take the advantages for the toggles, only ranks and AM. They seem rather useful, maybe more for pvp than pve. Like the slow effect on CM, Alpha strike on MM and teflon on MG

You take your defensive power far too late. You're gonna suffer to reach lvl 14 ! and 3 toggles that soon is definitely not gonna work well.


So can anyone please tell me just that :
Is it better to go with END/INT and run 3 toggles (I mean run it for more than 2 or 3s)
or CON/END and 2 toggles + automated assault with more survivability

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 10:11 AM
Con/int Ftw!

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 10:26 AM
Con/int Ftw!

Hmmmm. ok thx. Could you be more specific and develop that please ? Even tho I can't see myself not taking END.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 10:32 AM
As for talents, I am not sure ego or dex is any good for this build, might prefer that setup :

Talents:
Level 1: Technological Intuition
Level 6: Quick Recovery
Level 9: Negotiator
Level 12: Amazing Stamina
Level 15: Investigator
Level 18: Boundless Reserves
Level 21: Healthy Mind

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 11:25 AM
Int/End should be able to run all three eventually. Personally my int/end PA is 20 and I'd rather be running
CB+MG than MG+MM for anything that's tough to kill anyway.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 12:33 PM
As mentioned on another thread INT lowers the cost of powers. END raises your power pool. I have found through testing that INT helps me more than END as far as getting off the most shots. I tried SS Con/End and then redid it Con/Int. First off with Int I could pull off a full PG shot with Equlibrium. Could not do that specced End. Second I could fire off CG and MM without running out of energy. Could not do that with End. As I have dumped more Int into my build I have found it easier to keep the damage flowing.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 12:44 PM
I'm personally Int/Con SS'd and I love it. Of course I'm only level 20 but so far it's been working really well with invulnerability as a passive.

Personally I'm staying away from regen as I have a feeling it's going to get nerfed hard in upcoming patches and I'm just not sure about how it scales without Rec as a SS.

I generally run 3 toggles: wrist bolter with the advantage to make it a hand slot, MG, and MM and I can usually run 2 full MM cycles and a full MG cycle on a full bar of energy before I have to force shield/force sheath and regen my energy.

I'm not sure how much better off I'd be with Int/End SS'd but the extra HP from Con is a definite plus.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 12:46 PM
Literally copied and pasted. Sorry for the generally lazy reply, I'll have time to give you a proper answer when I get back from work.

Taken from the countless other threads available on this subject. I looked over the information I quoted in the other recent thread and it came out to like four pages. I would probably save time by just writing a full guide at this point.

In general, Power Armor works by running as many of your toggles as possible for the most amount of time possible over a given span. The single best stat for contributing to this goal is indisputably INT. END is the second best, given its highly synergistic effect with INT, which is explained in further detail below. REC is a decent stat to have on the side, but places a fairly solid third. It bears mentioning that REC is a much more attractive choice if you don't have INT as a primary stat.

INT/END + Quarry for pure DPS builds.
INT/CON + Invulnerability if you want a good mix of offense and defense.

INT is a very important staple for Power Armor. Our powers are, generally, fairly expensive in terms of END cost and our DPS only shines when we're running several powers simultaneously. INT is, hands down, the most efficient stat for contributing to this goal and has a synergistic effect with END that results in higher net returns when you focus on both stats.

CON greatly increases your base hit points and the efficiency of the percentile resistance from Invulnerability, which in turn makes you much harder to take down.

STR is largely unnecessary, unless you're making a Laser Knight (Laser Sword + Energy Shield with advantages in both) 'tank' build. It's nice to have, but unless you have a niche build, it's not better than the above three.

In the end though, it really depends on what you want to do with Power Armor. It doesn't play as nicely with other sets as some other frameworks since running any of its toggle abilities forces a 'global cooldown' on all of your non-PA powers for the toggles' durations. That said, there are some fantastic powers you can pick up in other sets to help your build.

In regards to why INT and END work together so well... let's take a look at two different situations:

Situation A:

* Maximum Endurance: 200
* Running 3 toggles; total cost per second = 70 endurance.
* INT as a super stat; contributing 40% total power cost reduction.


Situation B:

* Maximum Endurance: 250
* Running 3 toggles; total cost per second = 70 endurance.
* INT as a super stat; contributing 40% total power cost reduction.


In situation A, without your INT bonus, you would run out of endurance in ~2.86 seconds. With INT bonus included, you will run out of endurance in ~4.76 seconds. This is a difference of ~1.90 seconds.

In situation B, without your INT bonus, you would run out of endurance in ~3.57 seconds. With INT bonus included, you will run out of endurance in ~5.95 seconds. This is a difference of ~2.38 seconds.

What does this mean? In layman's terms, the more endurance you stack, the better the benefits of INT are. Both of them provide added sustainability on their own, but together, they create a synergistic effect that enhances the properties of INT, making it even better than it would be normally.

In order for Recovery to 'break even' with INT and END, the benefits it provides to your ability to sustain multiple toggles must be greater than or equal to the benefits provided by INT and END. However, since the endurance generated by momentum is not based on a percentage of your maximum endurance, but a static amount determined solely by your Recovery stat, this very rarely happens in practical application.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 12:59 PM
As a PA user i have minigun ( rank 1, teflon coated), mm (rank 2), and pg for attacks. Force shield (sheath advantage), inv (rank 1), and munitions bots. With a con/int build i wouldn't say i am invincible but tbh, i was in the desert and was doing ascIIIng for trouble open quest....and demolished a lot of things before it became too much. Turret mode on the munitions bots with MM, and MG made aoe amazing. While running these to ALMOST full duration, i used 1 fully charged power gauntlet blast with each full end bar. Tapping block for the sheath + inv helps a TON with henchmen damage, only wish i had a heal, but that is next level when i hit 20.

All in all i find my builds pretty awesome, but i keep looking at laser sword and wanting to play. Not sure how well it would suit me since i'm purely ranged, and besides orbital cannon i don't know what else i want power wise. Chest beam still looks to be meh compared to PG, and i tried shoulder launcher and laughed...lol it seems to be completely underpowered for such a high power. Anyone actually like shoulder launcher? rank 1 did horrible damage and it takes around 3-4 seconds for it to even fire!

Moral of my story, i <3 turret'd munitions bots until they die (which is often in large groups of mobs)



P.S. Tyril is a fountain of knowledge on PA and he helped loads when i was starting out. Search for his posts, he has a lot of info on these forums.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 01:30 PM
Con/int Ftw!

Yep I have a CON/INT build as well. At level 40 running invulnerability I find that STR adds to the absorption of damage and CON adds to the damage resistance. Earlier I ran Defiance all the way to level 40 and used the free retcon to switch to Invulnerability.

Defiance adds some very nice energy to the blue bar while foes attack you. Downside Defiance takes a few seconds to ramp up to full strength.

Meanwhile Invulnerability is always on and some foes damage will be less than my abosrption which means my Health bar stays full all during the attack. Downside I have to use my energy builder or block more to fill up the blue bar with energy.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 08:22 PM
Sorry I couldn't go over each of your questions earlier, but I'd be happy to take a crack at them now:

First off, take a quick read the bottom paragraph of my post on the first page. Power Armor has a few special considerations that can make it awkward when pairing it with other frameworks, such as its very heavy reliance on specific stats to be effective.

- The idea is to shoot Chest beam for debuff, then run 3 toggles at a time (WB with automated assault, MM and MG). Each toggle got Accelerated Metabolism for more energy. And I SS'ed Endu + Int.
First question, isn't that some sort of overkill ? With this setup, isn't END as a superstat enough to run the toggles properly?

Chest Beam does a lot of overhead damage, but has terrible endurance efficiency. In practical use, you'd probably one-shot a henchmen with 2/3 charged shot or take a villain down below half with a full charge. Regardless, it will pretty much wipe out all your endurance, so you're probably not going to follow it up by running three powers at once.

Accelerated Metabolism is nice if you know you're going to use a few specific attack powers (and thus, have extra advantage points to kick around,) but it's very inconsistent... as such, its benefits are best measured over time, not for 'opening bursts.'

Lastly, INT/END is definitely not overkill if you're planning on making a heavy DPS character. Power Armor abilities are generally very expensive and the cost stacks up pretty quickly when you're running powers concurrently. INT/END + Quarry is pretty much the closest you can come to running your powers non-stop.

-Second question, if I get to SS int, I'd like to take advantage of it for pets. But what are they worth nowadays ? I'm really unsure about it cos it doesn't fit the concept. If taking CON as a SS instead of INT, that would open two slots for powers. What would you recommend ? I heard Sonic is good when coupled with MG or MM.

In their current implementation, it is generally accepted that pets are very ineffective and just not really worth the hassle. However, you might do pretty well with Munitions Bots... passive DPS is rarely a bad thing. Try them out in the power house and see if you like them. You can always drop them if you change your mind.

- What does fit my concept tho, is minimines tho I am really reluctant to pick it due to OP/nerf concerns. I don't like FOTM. Well I mostly don't like having a nerfbat behind the ears... Might take Particle mine... but I have bad memories from it.


It's a great power right now, but I passed on it. I'm not really interested in FoTM builds myself... I'd rather focus on building a character that fits my play style. That said, power armor has a lot of alternatives if you're looking for AoE.

- Laser Sword : looks cool, and is usefull for added dmg (particle acceleration, and mainly, anti block)
Orbital Canon : well I can't see myself not taking it, would it hit for 1 dmg only it's just too cool to pass (former GDI player maybe )

Laser Sword is a fantastic, powerful melee ability... but if you're making a pure ranged DPS build, you'll find that you never use it. For characters that want to get a little closer to the action, it can be a really nice addition to your arsenal. Generally, I find that Particle Acceleration isn't really worth it... but your mileage may vary. Laser Sword works well with high INT characters, as it has an exceptionally high endurance cost to offset it's huge damage.

I agree with the cool factor of Orbital Cannon, but it will rarely make a better AoE "alpha strike" than your natural PA AoE abilities. That said... it's really cool. :D

- Ego Hold : never had a build without a hold, and that bubble would fit the concept, even if I had to change the colour

I personally find that I don't need a hold on my build (INT/CON defensive/offensive hybrid,) but you may find that it's very helpful to your survival... especially if you plan on taking Quarry (or PA's offensive passive, which is a decent alternative,) instead. In the current build of the game, stats no longer directly affect your chance to hold, so you don't need to worry about an "incompatibility" there anymore.

- Force Eruption : Fits the energy toon concept, and useful when held

Good for keeping enemies away from you, but it can be difficult to use when you really need it. When you're running Power Armor toggle abilities, all non-PA toggle abilities are temporarily "locked out" and cannot be used until the toggle durations run out or are manually canceled. This means that if you're using your toggles and get in trouble, you have to cancel all of them quickly to use it... which is very counter-intuitive.

- Some powers I am looking at :
PFF (I am actually rerolling to take regen instead...) but it fitted the concept better
Nanobot swarms, for easy survivability mode (Unbreakable + Resurgence without the 30s CD)

- Finally last question, talents and gear: Should I max end (prolly) and then focus on CON ? Int as a third if I go for END/CON as SS ?

I would prioritize INT above END as a super stat, as you will almost undoubtedly find that you get more mileage out of it. You can find my reasons in full on the first page... INT is basically undisputed as the better stat in maintaining your damage on Power Armor. The exception to this would be if you did in fact decide to take PFF... in which case END would have additional defensive benefits. I find that endurance is generally pretty easy to gear for, as is recovery. I can pretty easily fit them in as peripheral DPS stats where needed.

Recovery, frankly, is only useful for PA during the brief period where your endurance "taps out" for running your toggles, where you need to take a second or two to build it back up again before your next cycle. Your efforts are generally better spent making sure you can maintain them for their full durations first, and then adding additional recovery, so it's a decent "third stat" to look into if you already have a lot of INT and END.

Stay away from STR, DEX and EGO. Even if you have an invulnerability, you will generally get much better mileage out of INT/CON super stats than STR/CON... and STR contributes virtually nothing to power armor as a set. DEX isn't particularly helpful either... Power Armor focuses on doing consistent DPS with a lot of flexibility. Your damage will be higher maintaining your powers longer instead of focusing on crits. EGO is typically devalued for the same reason as DEX.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 08:28 PM
I saw this mentioned only once in a quote, but I thought that it was worth repeating. Keep in mind that INT doesn't just lower your power costs, but also decreases the recharge time on any ability with a cooldown (so any offensive/defensive buffs with those 1:30 cooldowns will seem much less painful), making it an even more uber stat than most others.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 08:39 PM
I saw this mentioned only once in a quote, but I thought that it was worth repeating. Keep in mind that INT doesn't just lower your power costs, but also decreases the recharge time on any ability with a cooldown (so any offensive/defensive buffs with those 1:30 cooldowns will seem much less painful), making it an even more uber stat than most others.

Nice catch. It slipped my mind while I was busy extolling its other virtues. :D

That said, it's not really a huge decrease to recast time... with my current INT values, I'm getting roughly a 70% discount to power cost and only like a 20% decrease to power recharge time. That said, it's another benefit on what is easily one of the best stats... and it is pretty noticeable. A 20% reduction brings a 1:30 timer down to 1:12, which isn't anything to sneeze at.

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 10:25 PM
-Second question, if I get to SS int, I'd like to take advantage of it for pets. But what are they worth nowadays ? I'm really unsure about it cos it doesn't fit the concept. If taking CON as a SS instead of INT, that would open two slots for powers. What would you recommend ? I heard Sonic is good when coupled with MG or MM.INT has no effect on Field Drones, which is the only pet you have selected. [ATM, I don't think Ranks even affect them.]
Now, I'm not sure if INT does affect damage of summoned "pets" like mines or not. I played around with pets a lot in beta, but things have changed.
Field drones are great if you don't mind summoning them a LOT...depending on your travel power (and how well they continue to fix pet/drone functionality).

Archived Post
09-14-2009, 11:29 PM
Wow I wasn't expecting this thread to catch the attention of so many PA experts, I am honored :D

Ok so I think I got your point about int. Really wasn't expecting this, but heh.

So lets say I run against a small group of henchmen + vilain, would that be a bad idea to fire Chest Beam (might not even fully charge it) on the vilain, fast end recharge then run the toggles? Or would the vilain (or master vilain) die with only 3 toggles ? Another option would be to fire Orbital, recharge then toggle everything on for nice fireworks effects :rolleyes:

As you might have understood with the build I intend to do some pvp eventually (laser sword is mainly taken for the crippling advantage)
What is generally accepted, is it better to go for

- full dps (INT/END + quarry) and be quite squishy
or
- Survivability (INT/CON + invul or regen)

A lot of builds include CON as a SS as it looks like one of the best SS to take. CO lets you pick a defensive Stat (like CON, REC, etc) but still scales dmg with it. But wouldn't a heal over time power (bionic shielding, nanobot swarm +adv, etc) coupled with a DPS build (INT/END + quarry) be a bad choice for pvp ? I noticed the healing powers are quite effective in this game, and might make up for not having such a big HP Pool.


Also I noticed something in the Powerhouse. I tried 2 toggles against someone in a duel, but I noticed the toggles kept shutting down when my opponent moved. Does the line of sight take obstacles like other people into account ? And it's definitely shutting down if your ennemy run in circles around you. Pvp is fast paced so I am quite disappointed with this issue. Taking a hold might fix that.

Force eruption is intented to keep ennemies at bay, like TK users who love holding you + EBB. It is not to run at the same time as toggles.

EDIT : I don't know if anyone tried this, but Quarry doesn't work if you rank it... didn't proc. Bugged it ingame.

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 05:34 AM
So lets say I run against a small group of henchmen + vilain, would that be a bad idea to fire Chest Beam (might not even fully charge it) on the vilain, fast end recharge then run the toggles? Or would the vilain (or master vilain) die with only 3 toggles ? Another option would be to fire Orbital, recharge then toggle everything on for nice fireworks effects :rolleyes:

Right now, henchmen cause a lot of damage on their own. From a survival standpoint, it makes more sense to remove as much damage as possible, as quickly as possible... and the easiest way to do that is to open up with a big alpha strike on the henchmen to take them out fast, then focus on any villains that are left standing.

I find that Villains go down pretty quickly under sustained firepower power... but it typically takes me about 1 - 2 rotations from full health.

As you might have understood with the build I intend to do some pvp eventually (laser sword is mainly taken for the crippling advantage)
What is generally accepted, is it better to go for

- full dps (INT/END + quarry) and be quite squishy
or
- Survivability (INT/CON + invul or regen)

A lot of builds include CON as a SS as it looks like one of the best SS to take. CO lets you pick a defensive Stat (like CON, REC, etc) but still scales dmg with it. But wouldn't a heal over time power (bionic shielding, nanobot swarm +adv, etc) coupled with a DPS build (INT/END + quarry) be a bad choice for pvp ? I noticed the healing powers are quite effective in this game, and might make up for not having such a big HP Pool.

I've been out of the PVP scene for a little bit, so I say this with a giant asterisk next to it, since it's in a constant state of flux... but since closed beta, the PVP status quot has always been in favor of defensive heroes. It's not necessarily that heals are "worse" than having a high hitpoint pool... it's that there's no reason you can't simply take both, which is even better. Dedicated support characters are very rare in PVP right now, so self-sustainability is important... if you make yourself an easy target, you'll basically just give the other team free points.

Also I noticed something in the Powerhouse. I tried 2 toggles against someone in a duel, but I noticed the toggles kept shutting down when my opponent moved. Does the line of sight take obstacles like other people into account ? And it's definitely shutting down if your ennemy run in circles around you. Pvp is fast paced so I am quite disappointed with this issue. Taking a hold might fix that.

Part of it is probably that the 50 foot 'leash' for your endurance builder is significantly shorter than most of your other ranged attacks. I haven't noticed other players causing line of sight issues, but physical obstacles often will.

Force eruption is intented to keep ennemies at bay, like TK users who love holding you + EBB. It is not to run at the same time as toggles.

This is true, but the point I was trying to get at is that it can be a real hassle to cancel all of your toggles so you can Force Eruption someone that decides to bull-rush you... which is something that is going to happen pretty frequently in PVP.

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 12:47 PM
I've been out of the PVP scene for a little bit, so I say this with a giant asterisk next to it, since it's in a constant state of flux... but since closed beta, the PVP status quot has always been in favor of defensive heroes. It's not necessarily that heals are "worse" than having a high hitpoint pool... it's that there's no reason you can't simply take both, which is even better. Dedicated support characters are very rare in PVP right now, so self-sustainability is important... if you make yourself an easy target, you'll basically just give the other team free points.

Well I kind of expected that. For some reason, survivability > dps in most games.

So if I join the CON/INT +regen/invul bandwagon, how long can we sustain 3 toggles ?

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 01:19 PM
Well I kind of expected that. For some reason, survivability > dps in most games.

So if I join the CON/INT +regen/invul bandwagon, how long can we sustain 3 toggles ?

That depends on what those three toggles are and what you focus your stats/talents on.

When I stack INT on my gear, however, the answer is "surprisingly long." My standard rotation is Mini Gun + Micro Munitions + Power Gauntlet (charged.) I can generally get full duration out of my toggle rotation without any problems in the balanced stance. In defensive stance, I prefer using Laser Sword... I don't go long enough without blocking to get the full duration of my toggles off anyway.

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 01:39 PM
The tree toggles I have in mind are MG/MM/Convulsor.
With a focus on INT with talents / gear, could these 3 run for full duration? Then if it's positive, I would gor for CON/END as fillers.

So even with a "survivability" build you got to block before the end of the toggles? Now that's interesting. It definitely makes the DPS build a suicide build.

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 01:52 PM
The tree toggles I have in mind are MG/MM/Convulsor.
With a focus on INT with talents / gear, could these 3 run for full duration? Then if it's positive, I would gor for CON/END as fillers.

So even with a "survivability" build you got to block before the end of the toggles? Now that's interesting. It definitely makes the DPS build a suicide build.

Do you mean Concussor Beam? It's fairly average in terms of power cost, so it should be possible... but you'd probably need to pad your top endurance pool and start the rotation from full endurance to maintain them for their full durations.

My character is built as a defensive/offensive hybrid. I basically have two builds: a well-balanced offensive mode with Invulnerability passive, designed to put out good AoE DPS without compramising survivability... and a tanking/heavy defense build, which stacks resistance heavily and uses the endurance generation from blocking to fuel a never-ending tirade of Laser Sword goodness. The constant blocking I referred to happens mostly with the defensive build... Laser Sword is a very fast attack and deals a lot of damage, but is very endurance intensive... so combat tends to resolve as "block, attack attack...ect."

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 01:58 PM
I see alot of people talking about the Force Shield + Sheath. But personaly I like the TK Shield becuase of the shield letf up after I release my block key. I gain back energy through that block, and take lowered dmg while I'm still attacking.

I'm also speced int/end so I took PFF, but might change to invuln (and stack some con maybe since I have a few talent points to respend since I took some recovery stuff.)

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 03:16 PM
Is there a reason people take con over str with invul?

I recently tested invul with str SS and then tested with con SS and str seemed to have more of an effect for defense - not to mention the added pick up and throw ability = decent damage, knock down, and travel power removal. EXCELENT for PvP.

I find when str is high enough, the large and massive objects take less than a second to pick up, though targeting something twice is a bit annoying.

Just wondering if a str/int build for PA would be as effective as a con/int build. I personally went with str/end - not knowing the awesome effects of int. Plus the added effects it would have on munitions bots could be fun. Hoping that my retcon still works :)

Archived Post
09-15-2009, 04:31 PM
Is there a reason people take con over str with invul?

To put it very simply... yes.

Point for point, CON provides better overall mitigation than STR. That is to say, when the average damage taken in combat is factored over time, you will find that between two Invulnerability characters with "inverted" values for STR and CON, the character with higher CON will mitigate more damage on average.

Now, that "on average" is an important caveat... STR affects the 'damage soak' component of Invulnerability, which makes it very effective when using a Rank 3 block power or against very light attacks/DoTs. However, the percentile mitigation of Invulnerability (affected by CON,) stacks multiplicatively with other sources of resistance.

The only other tangible benefit that taking STR gives you as a Power Armor build is the "lift component" that you mentioned... but you already have several effective AoE and single target ranged attacks, most of which offer outright better options than throwing environmental objects in terms of overhead damage.

CON, on the other hand, has the side effect of giving you an enormous increase to your hitpoints... the survivability benefits of which should be obvious.

So, basically, if you can only take one... you're almost always better off going CON with Power Armor, which is why it's such a popular choice.

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 03:56 AM
Do you mean Concussor Beam? It's fairly average in terms of power cost, so it should be possible... but you'd probably need to pad your top endurance pool and start the rotation from full endurance to maintain them for their full durations.

My character is built as a defensive/offensive hybrid. I basically have two builds: a well-balanced offensive mode with Invulnerability passive, designed to put out good AoE DPS without compramising survivability... and a tanking/heavy defense build, which stacks resistance heavily and uses the endurance generation from blocking to fuel a never-ending tirade of Laser Sword goodness. The constant blocking I referred to happens mostly with the defensive build... Laser Sword is a very fast attack and deals a lot of damage, but is very endurance intensive... so combat tends to resolve as "block, attack attack...ect."

Hehe ya, Convulsor is the name on my client, don't know why they didn't keep Concussor when they translated, as it makes more sense.

Anyway it is nice to know I can have a "survivability" build with all 3 toggles. PA's concept isn't a squishy one anyway lol
Considering how good regen is, why Invul ? Concept thingy ? Or with CON is it more effective than Regen (which uses REC I think)
As for your tanking build, how do you stack resistance ? At my level (20) every single gear has the same resistance on it, if it's the same level. So I don't really have to choose between stats and resist. Maybe it changes later ? I guess you use invul on that build too. And Force shield with the end-regen component.

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 04:00 AM
I see alot of people talking about the Force Shield + Sheath. But personaly I like the TK Shield becuase of the shield letf up after I release my block key. I gain back energy through that block, and take lowered dmg while I'm still attacking.

I'm also speced int/end so I took PFF, but might change to invuln (and stack some con maybe since I have a few talent points to respend since I took some recovery stuff.)

Beware on that, the lingering effect is to be removed soon on that shield

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 04:00 AM
Is there a reason people take con over str with invul?

I recently tested invul with str SS and then tested with con SS and str seemed to have more of an effect for defense - not to mention the added pick up and throw ability = decent damage, knock down, and travel power removal. EXCELENT for PvP.

I find when str is high enough, the large and massive objects take less than a second to pick up, though targeting something twice is a bit annoying.

Just wondering if a str/int build for PA would be as effective as a con/int build. I personally went with str/end - not knowing the awesome effects of int. Plus the added effects it would have on munitions bots could be fun. Hoping that my retcon still works :)

I was around in the Powerhouse yesterday, duelling random people for fun, and some Might Hero came and started throwing stuff at me. I noticed that I couldn't block the biggest boxes, and they hit me for like 1,5k damage at lvl 14. Nice pvp tool indeed.

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 07:33 AM
Hehe ya, Convulsor is the name on my client, don't know why they didn't keep Concussor when they translated, as it makes more sense.

Anyway it is nice to know I can have a "survivability" build with all 3 toggles. PA's concept isn't a squishy one anyway lol
Considering how good regen is, why Invul ? Concept thingy ? Or with CON is it more effective than Regen (which uses REC I think)
As for your tanking build, how do you stack resistance ? At my level (20) every single gear has the same resistance on it, if it's the same level. So I don't really have to choose between stats and resist. Maybe it changes later ? I guess you use invul on that build too. And Force shield with the end-regen component.

The gear-based resistance (like -50% energy damage) is certainly nice and is very effective when you know you're going to be taking specific damage types... but what I'm referencing when I say 'resistance stacking' is using multiple powers that grant resistance bonuses in tandem to achieve a 'better than the sum of their parts' effect.

Laser Knight, Defensive Combo and Invulnerability all "stack" multiplicatively, so by using them all together... your survivability takes a sharp and sudden turn upwards.

This technique effectively works with Regen, too... by reducing the amount of incoming damage you take, you increase Regeneration's relative effectiveness, because the enemies have to do that much more damage over the same span of time to "break" your regeneration rate.

They're both good approaches... the difference is in how they play and handle. Regeneration has to play a careful balancing act when engaging lots of opponents at once. Invulnerability is better at "wading into" a dangerous situation, but is less effective as the fight drags out.

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 11:02 AM
With regards to SSing Con/Int, which crafting path would you take? Crafting still utterly confuses me and I've got 3 characters around level 20 all with maxed out crafting for their level, or close to it.

Archived Post
09-16-2009, 11:21 AM
I always thought crafts were the same as for stats, that it was just a concept thing with different items to gather. Might have been wrong on that :D