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Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:17 PM
The recent patch has made the game unheroic in my opinion. MY enjoyment of the game has dropped dramatically with the character nerfs. I like to solo and now I feel I have to group to get things done. As an example..the goldmine fiend leech was a fun villain. That is until the force field nerf..now I cant beat him when Im 2 lvls higher than him...I had to retcon to a different spec just to barely get by him. This takes the superheroic aspect away from the game and in m y opinion I hope that cryptic goes back to the way it was. I also have issue with nerfing movement powers. I see some complain but I dont feel I should be punished because others are running at min requirments for the game. if they are having trouble with lag then I suggest am upgrade of thier system so they arent running at min.:mad:

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:19 PM
I thought the last patch was really good. They changed a lot of stuff, fixed some stuff added some cool stuff.

By the way force field was not nerfed in the last patch.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:21 PM
I thought the last patch was really good. They changed a lot of stuff, fixed some stuff added some cool stuff.

By the way force field was not nerfed in the last patch.

For that matter didn't they decrease the hit points of the level 11 - 13 villains and minions?

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:27 PM
Are you referring to Force Shield's Force Sheath? We don't always agree with the game designers about their nerfs, but in this particular case, I do. You already have awesome energy return from Force Sheath, can't have awesome defense at the same time. Yes, I have this power on one of my characters.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:37 PM
Just so you know, it's only a matter of time before some troll declares you should "go back to wow". Apparently that's the common line these days for the uber-leets who didn't have a problem with the launch day patch nerfing the entire game.

For the trolls: if you really like the game then you might consider NOT telling people to leave and take their subscription fees with them. As with any subscription-based game, as more people leave there is less income for the developer, less incentive for them to support and expand the game. If you like the game you should want it to be successful, so how about knocking off the whole "then just leave" crap.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:44 PM
You're a bit late to the party OP, I think what you wanted was to post about how the sky fell with the September 1st patch.
The "recent patch" fixed a lot of things and it certainly didn't nerf PFF.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 04:46 PM
Just so you know, it's only a matter of time before some troll declares you should "go back to wow". Apparently that's the common line these days for the uber-leets who didn't have a problem with the launch day patch nerfing the entire game.

For the trolls: if you really like the game then you might consider NOT telling people to leave and take their subscription fees with them. As with any subscription-based game, as more people leave there is less income for the developer, less incentive for them to support and expand the game. If you like the game you should want it to be successful, so how about knocking off the whole "then just leave" crap.

talk about jumping the gun and over reacting I do belive the Devs police the forums why not add something useful to the thread

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 05:47 PM
talk about jumping the gun and over reacting I do belive the Devs police the forums why not add something useful to the thread

No no he obviously has to feel morally superior by prejudging people and rushing in to do so before anyone has done any of the things he decries. Talk about prejudgmental and bigoted.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 05:58 PM
Just so you know, it's only a matter of time before some troll declares you should "go back to wow". Apparently that's the common line these days for the uber-leets who didn't have a problem with the launch day patch nerfing the entire game.

For the trolls: if you really like the game then you might consider NOT telling people to leave and take their subscription fees with them. As with any subscription-based game, as more people leave there is less income for the developer, less incentive for them to support and expand the game. If you like the game you should want it to be successful, so how about knocking off the whole "then just leave" crap.

Trust me if all the forum whiners quit today. It won' t even make a dent on CO subs. Majority of players in game don't even give damn about forums.

So yes if you are unhappy and constantly complaining, find a game which makes you happy.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 05:58 PM
Just so you know, it's only a matter of time before some troll declares you should "go back to wow". Apparently that's the common line these days for the uber-leets who didn't have a problem with the launch day patch nerfing the entire game.

For the trolls: if you really like the game then you might consider NOT telling people to leave and take their subscription fees with them. As with any subscription-based game, as more people leave there is less income for the developer, less incentive for them to support and expand the game. If you like the game you should want it to be successful, so how about knocking off the whole "then just leave" crap.

I have seen alot of things but ive never seen a pre-emptive troll for trolls who arent trolling!!! ;)

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 05:58 PM
Are you referring to Force Shield's Force Sheath? We don't always agree with the game designers about their nerfs, but in this particular case, I do. You already have awesome energy return from Force Sheath, can't have awesome defense at the same time. Yes, I have this power on one of my characters.

Why, exactly, can't you have good defense and good energy return? What's next, "NERF! Superman is bulletproof AND can fire lasers from his eyes!"?

If I wanted a game where I was average Joe with a weird look, there are plenty of other MMOs that provide just that. It's a game about being a comic book hero, I don't want it balanced like we were Orcs and Humans.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 05:59 PM
Just so you know, it's only a matter of time before some troll declares you should "go back to wow". Apparently that's the common line these days for the uber-leets who didn't have a problem with the launch day patch nerfing the entire game.

For the trolls: if you really like the game then you might consider NOT telling people to leave and take their subscription fees with them. As with any subscription-based game, as more people leave there is less income for the developer, less incentive for them to support and expand the game. If you like the game you should want it to be successful, so how about knocking off the whole "then just leave" crap.

What's with the pre-emptive anti-anti-wow attack?

The OP set himself up for one. What he should have asked is, how can I feel more heroic? What is the best way to respec a character? Something along those lines, as plenty of other have.

What do you qualify as uber-leet, since there really isn't any uber-loot to speak of? Someone who uses the shift key to block?

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:01 PM
What's with the pre-emptive anti-anti-wow attack?

The OP set himself up for one. What he should have asked is, how can I feel more heroic? What is the best way to respec a character? Something along those lines, as plenty of other have.

What do you qualify as uber-leet, since there really isn't any uber-loot to speak of? Someone who uses the shift key to block?

He could have even said I'm level 10 in the burning sands area with the following powers and having a hard time. Does anyone have advice? That would have elicited a lot of positive helpful posts.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:03 PM
The recent patch has made the game unheroic in my opinion. MY enjoyment of the game has dropped dramatically with the character nerfs. I like to solo and now I feel I have to group to get things done. As an example..the goldmine fiend leech was a fun villain. That is until the force field nerf..now I cant beat him when Im 2 lvls higher than him...I had to retcon to a different spec just to barely get by him. This takes the superheroic aspect away from the game and in m y opinion I hope that cryptic goes back to the way it was. I also have issue with nerfing movement powers. I see some complain but I dont feel I should be punished because others are running at min requirments for the game. if they are having trouble with lag then I suggest am upgrade of thier system so they arent running at min.:mad:

So in your opinion in order for one to be heroic they can only fight people who are much weaker than themselves? That doesn't sound like a hero to me, more like a bully. What is it about a hero going against on who can match him in his league that strips him of his "hero-dom"?

Does Spiderman fighting Venom, someone who has pasted spiderman on many occasions mean that Spiderman is no longer a hero? Would assaulting (not fighting when the other side doesn't stand a change) someone like Typeface be the only way for Spiderman to be considered a hero?

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:06 PM
Trust me if all the forum whiners quit today. It won' t even make a dent on CO subs. Majority of players in game don't even give damn about forums.

So yes if you are unhappy and constantly complaining, find a game which makes you happy.

lol i know alot them quit without ever coming to the forums also....almost ever thread where someone has a issue with the game you tell them to leave. You a great help to our lil community /yay

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:06 PM
So in your opinion in order for one to be heroic they can only fight people who are much weaker than themselves? That doesn't sound like a hero to me, more like a bully. What is it about a hero going against on who can match him in his league that strips him of his "hero-dom"?

Does Spiderman fighting Venom, someone who has pasted spiderman on many occasions mean that Spiderman is no longer a hero? Would assaulting (not fighting when the other side doesn't stand a change) someone like Typeface be the only way for Spiderman to be considered a hero?

Leech ain't exactly a superstar supervillian, y'know. If Batman were losing constantly to Harley Quinn, much less the Joker, it kind of strips the heroism out of it. If Spiderman were losing to typeface, he sure ain't a hero.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:10 PM
lol i know alot them quit without ever coming to the forums also....almost ever thread where someone has a issue with the game you tell them to leave. You a great help to our lil community /yay

No i tell people to leave whose post count is only full of whines and complain and who themselves threaten to leave but never do.:rolleyes:

And if you think the whiners threating to leave on forums in any way indicate threat to CO then you have never played EVE or visited their forums. Sadly, whiners are always the loudest and hardly make any rational or constructive comment.

But you are most welcome to play their bodyguard.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:13 PM
Are you referring to Force Shield's Force Sheath? We don't always agree with the game designers about their nerfs, but in this particular case, I do. You already have awesome energy return from Force Sheath, can't have awesome defense at the same time. Yes, I have this power on one of my characters.

Force sheath had a defence aswell for the linger?

never noticed TBH :D

Ontopic, leech is really easy imo, took him with a glass cannon fire guy, he did less damage than a handful of henchies.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:16 PM
I agree OP. It was the same story with CoH (although it was much too easy early on there). Comic book heroes don't get defeated fighting 3 backalley thugs. Period. We aren't talking Venom vs. spidey here boss... we're talking spidey vs. 3 guys with baseball bats.

I do agree with the comparison to wow in that the same thing happened here that happened there. Nerfs for a PvE game for PvP purposes (amongst other reasons). Calls for balance are rediculous in my opinion. The fun of the game is (for me) in the concept and execution. We shouldn't have to force cookie cutter builds to succeed. Champions was promoted with total customization, so I could play with any hero I could imagine, I didn't have to take mini-mines or PFF, I could make the hero I WANTED to make. That was the beauty of Beta and one of the reasons I loved the game. I still enjoy it much, but I miss that aspect, now its just another min/max mmo. I can't make the heroes for concept and still play, I have to step out and fit the mold too often to be able to solo along.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:16 PM
No i tell people to leave whose post count is only full of whines and complain and who themselves threaten to leave but never do.:rolleyes:

And if you think the whiners threating to leave on forums in any way indicate threat to CO then you have never played EVE or visited their forums. Sadly, whiners are always the loudest and hardly make any rational or constructive comment.

But you are most welcome to play their bodyguard.

No i never played eve and if people act like over there no wonder that game lives thur a lil fanbase. Hopefully this game will have a large customer base so they can fix bugs and give us bigger and better content. :p We don't want this to become a cult fav where newcomers are pushed out from....well lifers.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:20 PM
A hero (Ancient Greek: ἥρως, hērōs), in Greek mythology and folklore, was originally a demigod, their cult being one of the most distinctive features of ancient Greek religion.[1] Later, hero (male) and heroine (female) came to refer to characters who, in the face of danger and adversity or from a position of weakness, display courage and the will for self sacrifice that is, heroism for some greater good, originally of martial courage or excellence but extended to more general moral excellence.

I suspect the above paragraph is why we have this disconnect. Some folks expect demigods, and others feel that a hero is defined by his motivations and the difficulty of his challenges.

For myself, I think heroism is only possible against enemies or situations which are a genuine threat.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:24 PM
No i never played eve and if people act like over there no wonder that game lives thur a lil fanbase. Hopefully this game will have a large customer base so they can fix bugs and give us bigger and better content. :p We don't want this to become a cult fav where newcomers are pushed out from....well lifers.

EVE has 300,000 active subs and they are releasing new expansion which will enable people to walk in station and trade etc. Companies of games with small player base does not spend that much money. When ever i read EVE forums, sky is falling. But for 4+ years EVE is CCP's vision. They don't care about players threating to quit with their entire guilds, their moms, neighbors and dogs.

Same thing is happening here. CO is a niche game just like COH was and still is. And no matter how many threats are made CO is only going to get stronger in future.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:27 PM
Mickey, I am probably setting myself up for this, but In this thread , I saw a number of people post thoughtful and amused responses to the ops, I am not saying anything about that, but I cant help but notice that your response was the only truly agressive on, as were your follow up posts, and I've seen a similar kind of trend in other threads you have posted in. If all you ever post is vitriol against people posting bad things about the game (and please can we make a distinction between whiners and people who attempt to post a thoughtful entry about their enjoyment or lack thereof of the game?) that doesnt speak well for you, you seem to be one of the ragequitter types, just in the other camp. Its really bugging me. Sorry If you are offended but to be perfectly honest the tone of your posts offends ME. Plenty of people are unhappy with the patch, plenty are happy. I dont have access to hard figures, and probably neither do you or even cryptic (number of people logging in isnt exactly the same as enjoyment, thought I do agrre its a good basis for assumption) but if someone isnt enjoying themselves and believes they have a valid complaint, however they express it, laughing them off with a superior attitude doesnt make you better than them. also Isnt it possible that some people arent enjoying themselves AS MUCH as before? maybe its a really great neopolitan ice cream you're munching, and suddenly someone takes your chocolate and strawberry and now you've just got vanilla, nothnig to cry about, but not as good. Maybe Im just tired and cranky. but if this person is really so unimportant to you, just dont post in their thread. Tbh I would like to see less of this agression on both sides of the issue. it only discourages new posters who might otherwise make this forum something more than "the eve and wow boards" everyone talks about. A forum was a place for discussion, a thoughful and serious discussion, people trolling and making junk AMH YOU RUINED MY LIFE posts arent helping but neither are you.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:34 PM
Mickey, I am probably setting myself up for this, but In this thread , I saw a number of people post thoughtful and amused responses to the ops, I am not saying anything about that, but I cant help but notice that your response was the only truly agressive on, as were your follow up posts, and I've seen a similar kind of trend in other threads you have posted in. If all you ever post is vitriol against people posting bad things about the game (and please can we make a distinction between whiners and people who attempt to post a thoughtful entry about their enjoyment or lack thereof of the game?) that doesnt speak well for you, you seem to be one of the ragequitter types, just in the other camp. Its really bugging me. Sorry If you are offended but to be perfectly honest the tone of your posts offends ME. Plenty of people are unhappy with the patch, plenty are happy. I dont have access to hard figures, and probably neither do you or even cryptic (number of people logging in isnt exactly the same as enjoyment, thought I do agrre its a good basis for assumption) but if someone isnt enjoying themselves and believes they have a valid complaint, however they express it, laughing them off with a superior attitude doesnt make you better than them. also Isnt it possible that some people arent enjoying themselves AS MUCH as before? maybe its a really great neopolitan ice cream you're munching, and suddenly someone takes your chocolate and strawberry and now you've just got vanilla, nothnig to cry about, but not as good. Maybe Im just tired and cranky. but if this person is really so unimportant to you, just dont post in their thread. Tbh I would like to see less of this agression on both sides of the issue. it only discourages new posters who might otherwise make this forum something more than "the eve and wow boards" everyone talks about. A forum was a place for discussion, a thoughful and serious discussion, people trolling and making junk AMH YOU RUINED MY LIFE posts arent helping but neither are you.

That wall of text hurt bad but to keep things short. If you think any of these regular whiners contribute anything positive instead of cluttering the forum with over repetitive complains then you do not read enough. People with genuine complaints do not make threat. They give advice like mature people. Most of these people do not even care to post in already existing similar topics. But i guess making a new topic about same issue 10 times a day will surely get them attention? not to mention insults thrown towards devs and i am canceling my sub threat for every single problem in game.

I have only seen two people so far give some constructive feedback. And i have bookmarked those. Rest is just desperate call for attention and nothing else.

I have no sympathy for those who think that by making threats they can get what they want.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:36 PM
EVE has 300,000 active subs and they are releasing new expansion which will enable people to walk in station and trade etc. Companies of games with small player base does not spend that much money. When ever i read EVE forums, sky is falling. But for 4+ years EVE is CCP's vision. They don't care about players threating to quit with their entire guilds, their moms, neighbors and dogs.

Same thing is happening here. CO is a niche game just like COH was and still is. And no matter how many threats are made CO is only going to get stronger in future.

Ok......300,000 subs to games like maplestory that has more subs than wow. 300,000 is a small game base for a game that been out for years. I'm not worried about types that like to push people out the door. Lets find ways to their problem instead telling them to leave. The op problem is endgame why not help him with stuff to do that he maybe doesnt know about.

Just because people post neg. things about the game they shouldnt be bash. Lets help our communty not make people feel if they post something they will be blacklisted.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:36 PM
I suspect the above paragraph is why we have this disconnect. Some folks expect demigods, and others feel that a hero is defined by his motivations and the difficulty of his challenges.

For myself, I think heroism is only possible against enemies or situations which are a genuine threat.

But a group of 3 sissies beating you to death with pillows, hardly seems like a threat at first until you are dead. That is where I see the disconnect. Gotta say, I have been one of the guys who through all of launch days and subsequent patches had been laughing at all the folks saying the game was broke. It isn't so funny when they finally get to you.

Today I log into my level 19 Dual Blade and start getting pasted against the pulls with two sheriff deputies and the one other mob. All 3 were level 19 like me. The quest was a level 18. This is the 5th character that I have brought up to the Gulch (waiting for my slow friend) and had not seen this before. Last night this was not the case either when I began the Gulch quests. Something in todays patch. Like everyone is saying losing to a Supervillain=Heroic. Losing to his entry level Stooge=Sad. Lets not forget, we are playing a comic book. This never happens in any comic I have read.

I love the hell out of this game. I started with 7 other folks and 6 quit for other endeavors (not WoW) and only two of us remain. I am a lifer but if the game continues to become less fun, I see less reasons to keep playing. It is getting harder to defend. I am almost on the verge of joining that close to 700 post thread.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:40 PM
Ok......300,000 subs to games like maplestory that has more subs than wow. 300,000 is a small game base for a game that been out for years. I'm not worried about types that like to push people out the door. Lets find ways to their problem instead telling them to leave. The op problem is endgame why not help him with stuff to do that he maybe doesnt know about.

Just because people post neg. things about the game they shouldnt be bash. Lets help our communty not make people feel if they post something they will be blacklisted.

Again to repeat myself people who give constructive feedback do so without any threats. it is so easy to spot such people. The people you are talking about do not fall in those MATURE player base category. So i its more like an advice from me..

if someone can find only negativity in something and is constantly only complaining. the most obvious thing to do is move on with your life. Better then spoiling forums for those who try to give constructive feedback. Which rarely happens here.

Also you dont need over a million subs to call MMO a big or successful game.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:48 PM
Ok......300,000 subs to games like maplestory that has more subs than wow. 300,000 is a small game base for a game that been out for years. I'm not worried about types that like to push people out the door. Lets find ways to their problem instead telling them to leave. The op problem is endgame why not help him with stuff to do that he maybe doesnt know about.

Just because people post neg. things about the game they shouldnt be bash. Lets help our communty not make people feel if they post something they will be blacklisted.

300,000 counts as very succesful and highly profitable. Cryptic have stated that 100k-150k is counted as a success and brings enough money to sustain the game and release expansions. 300k is a hgreat achievment, people are so used to seeing WoW tout their huge numbers, that anything below half a mil seems pathetic.

300,000 x $15 sub (not sure on us sub rates) $4,500,000 a month.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:54 PM
Heck at times Eve had around 80,000 subs and they soldiered on and released patches and content. Granted, 300,000 don't sound like much but it is still almost 4x what they had for a while. Niche market games can survive.

Mickey, I can see where you are coming from with the threat thing. "Fix this or I am leaving" does sound juvenile. I also understand why many won't post in a thread with a post count of over 600. By the time a thread hits page 63 it is about useless. Folks want to think their voice is being heard. When I have a "legit" gripe, I look for a thread near page 1 or 2 that seems to fit my uses and post such as this one.

Many of the threads are really fodder too. Things like "I can't turn my computer on...it's you fault Cryptic" don't hold weight. But ongoing nerf after nerf is on many minds so this does.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 06:58 PM
Heck at times Eve had around 80,000 subs and they soldiered on and released patches and content. Granted, 300,000 don't sound like much but it is still almost 4x what they had for a while. Niche market games can survive.

Yeah i remember those early days when 100 people doing pvp in high security space used to crash the server :D If i believed the whines on forums that game should have died years ago.

CO has a lot better start and i firmly believe that this game is going to be a success like EVE in future.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 07:09 PM
Thanks everyone, especially the OP. I need to get up really early in the morning, but was having trouble getting sleepy. The "I'm a gimp and fixing god mode abilities makes me feel unheroic" number 1,000,001 has put me in a state of deep relaxation. Great Job!

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 07:15 PM
The recent patch has made the game unheroic in my opinion. MY enjoyment of the game has dropped dramatically with the character nerfs. I like to solo and now I feel I have to group to get things done. As an example..the goldmine fiend leech was a fun villain. That is until the force field nerf..now I cant beat him when Im 2 lvls higher than him...I had to retcon to a different spec just to barely get by him. This takes the superheroic aspect away from the game and in m y opinion I hope that cryptic goes back to the way it was. I also have issue with nerfing movement powers. I see some complain but I dont feel I should be punished because others are running at min requirments for the game. if they are having trouble with lag then I suggest am upgrade of thier system so they arent running at min.:mad:

I actually agree with your perspective. I purchased the game because what I played in OB and Headstart is what I expected from the launched product. I was prepared for tweaks and tuning but not a general overhaul of how the game flowed at it's core. I'm having much less fun now and that's unfortunate because I really loved what the game was. If you are truly unhappy with what the Devs pushed out on the 1st (with no testing or warning), then I suggest you call Customer Service and get your money back for your 6mo or Lifetime subs while you still can. There is no reason why you should be expected to pay for a product that has changed so much in such a short amount of time.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 07:26 PM
He could have even said I'm level 10 in the burning sands area with the following powers and having a hard time. Does anyone have advice? That would have elicited a lot of positive helpful posts.

This is probably the number 1 problem with game forums like this.

For some reason people are so afraid to admit that they don't necessarily know anything that they wrap a request for help up as instead an attack on whatever game might be relevant. That way they don't have to deal with the issues of not being perfect or not knowing something or feeling inferior just because they are ignorant of something new.

I think a lot of people get better at this as they get older, but to be honest, it is something most people probably don't shed unless they actively choose to do so.

There is nothing wrong with asking for help or assistance if you don't understand something. Sure someone might poke fun, but who cares. If you want to learn and have a legitimate question, just ask. No need to wrap it as an attack on a game.

Yet this is what 75% of the complaint threads here are.. They are actually people asking for help to find out information about something they are ignorant about, but instead of just asking for help they go around the completely other way, which is not the best way to get people to help you, even if you do sometimes or even often end up with the information you wanted.

Archived Post
09-11-2009, 07:32 PM
Or maybe it's a simple matter of he wasn't having any trouble yesterday, but he's having trouble today. Somehow, I doubt he has amnesia and has forgotten everything overnight. Which brings into serious doubt that the problem was his lack of knowledge.