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Archived Post
05-19-2011, 08:41 AM
I can;t beat her and every time I lose I have to start over.
Very, very, very frustrating.

Help, please.
Thanks.

Archived Post
05-19-2011, 08:57 AM
Yeah the demon key regeneration is very very very annoying and sometimes the rift seems to stuck so you are beating waves of waves of the rift minions but the rift doesnt get damage.

Archived Post
05-19-2011, 09:22 AM
I can;t beat her and every time I lose I have to start over.
Very, very, very frustrating.

Help, please.
Thanks.

Find a team.

Archived Post
05-19-2011, 10:12 AM
I did it on elite with my soldier and if i don't have time to regen i m dead when she's calling the demon key it's imposible try to regen as much as you can before you kill em of course start with the demon key . For arcana better you block her charged atack otherwise she'll eat your hp bad =/ once demon key is on the floor you should not have problems.

Here there's an other topic bout that if that doesn't help you : here (http://forums.champions-online.com/showthread.php?t=129745)

Archived Post
05-19-2011, 10:45 AM
If you are melee, keep an eye on her. Every now and then she charges a knockback aoe that deals decent damage.

During the rift thing, you have to beat the minions and then walk over the orbs that spawn on their death place (I think they are called "inestability" or something). Also, don`t go fight them close to the rift, it deals damage and I think it heals.

When the Demon Key appears, kill the Demon Key first. If you don`t, Arcana will cast something on it and heal herself everytime you manage to take out a bar. Now you need to keep an eye on both of them: she has a telegraphed charged attack (she had it before, too) that must be blocked, and the Key will Devour your Essence without warning and heal a ton of its lost HP.

Archived Post
05-20-2011, 11:02 PM
Find a team.



A person should not HAVE to find a team to play and enjoy content they PAY for, as it has been said...packs are suppose to scale for solo players.

There are a lot of ppl who play and LIKE to solo for whatever reason. The response of find a team is both null and obsurd.

Archived Post
05-21-2011, 01:38 AM
What I want to know is is it possible to get OUT of the fight with arcane if you cant handle her? Iirc the door is locked and if you relog you end up back in the fight. Would I need to petition?

Archived Post
05-21-2011, 02:11 AM
A person should not HAVE to find a team to play and enjoy content they PAY for, as it has been said...packs are suppose to scale for solo players.

There are a lot of ppl who play and LIKE to solo for whatever reason. The response of find a team is both null and obsurd.

Well, I never! Grouping in an MMO.. the very idea!

Archived Post
05-21-2011, 04:33 AM
Doing Resistance in a group of five is a lot of fun, but that really isn't the point.

It costs silver subscribers money to access it, and it wasn't advertised as requiring a group. There is therefore, for better or worse, a requirement for it to be soloable.

Archived Post
05-21-2011, 05:21 AM
What I want to know is is it possible to get OUT of the fight with arcane if you cant handle her? Iirc the door is locked and if you relog you end up back in the fight. Would I need to petition?

If you log out and wait 5 minutes, you should end up back in MC instead when you log in.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 02:22 AM
Yes, very annoying. Warden Arcana is not soloable for my character @ level 15, I can't scratch the demon key as he heals up at my expense while Arcane is pounding from range - which I don't have myself... Blocking just delays the inevitable, and removes all hope of further scratching the demon key. Bad balance! I wouldn't have wasted all this time getting there. Also pretty hateful that there is no Leave Instance option, I ran into that problem last night on another character when a mob was stuck in a wall with no line of sight, and I couldn't progress, and I waited 30 minutes not getting reply to my ticket so I logged. It looks like I will have to forfeit all these adventures which is a sad thing.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 02:48 AM
SOoOoOoooooo FRUSTRATING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and downright bloody stupid to force players to start over and over and over and over and over to get so far and either be worn out from gettting that far or just out of gameplay time and need a little break to face the impoossibility of killing Arcana. Bad enough to copy City of Heroes Idea for an adventure pack. Please Hotfix this so as to be able to save at least when u get to Arcana PLEASE!!

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 04:37 AM
Bad enough to copy City of Heroes Idea for an adventure pack.

Multifaria is a pretty prominent part of the existing IP's lore, people have been expecting to do missions here since CO's launch, this was certainly not an attempt to copy CoX.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 05:25 AM
When the Demon Key appears, kill the Demon Key first. If you don`t, Arcana will cast something on it and heal herself everytime you manage to take out a bar

I noticed that, on Elite, attacking Arcana so she can heal and shrink the Demon Key can be an useful strategy as each time Demon Key is shrunk, his damage and HP shrink too. If you keep insisting hitting Arcana, Demon Key will eventually vanish. However, on Elite, it's a long fight.

But I agree, his Devour Essence is TOO efficient, might be a good idea to reduce the effects of the healing part.

Also a little exploit : When Arcana is about to summon the Demon Key, if your auto-attack mode is "never change" and you have a ranged Energy Builder (or are close to Arcana), it will attack the Key during the custcene and it's highly probable DK will shrink at least once before the fight begins, reducing his HP and damage.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 08:48 AM
****ing block, how does it work? :rolleyes:

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 09:18 AM
A couple of thoughts, with a question:

Block is the "shift" key on your keyboard, or you can click on it with the mouse and hold the button down until you wish to stop blocking.

If you block while the Demon Key is attempting to self-heal, will that block the heal aspect of the Demon Key's attack? I heard that blocking shuts off healing for NPC life drain attacks, perhaps it also works for devour essence.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 11:38 AM
Doing Resistance in a group of five is a lot of fun, but that really isn't the point.

It costs silver subscribers money to access it, and it wasn't advertised as requiring a group. There is therefore, for better or worse, a requirement for it to be soloable.

I just soloed it this morning on elite, so it's soloable. The requirement is met. *shrugs*

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 12:00 PM
If you block while the Demon Key is attempting to self-heal, will that block the heal aspect of the Demon Key's attack? I heard that blocking shuts off healing for NPC life drain attacks, perhaps it also works for devour essence.

I doesn't prevent the heal and damage but it reduces them a lot.

Archived Post
05-28-2011, 03:49 PM
i actually found it easier to focus on Arcana rather than the Demon Key when i did this fight. yes, it heals her, but only a few times before it's all used up and disappears. after that, you only have to worry about her.

i did this with my lvl 17 darkness toon, so i'm not sure how other builds would fare; nor am i sure this would work for everyone. i only know what worked for me.

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 03:57 PM
i actually found it easier to focus on Arcana rather than the Demon Key when i did this fight. yes, it heals her, but only a few times before it's all used up and disappears. after that, you only have to worry about her.

i did this with my lvl 17 darkness toon, so i'm not sure how other builds would fare; nor am i sure this would work for everyone. i only know what worked for me.

(not to dig up an old thread but this is horrible!)

it takes a level 17 to complete a mission that's level 11! Between this and the "Splinter Cell" like sneaking around quest I did just prior to this one I don't feel very "Super Hero" at all. I feel like I should have played this game more prior to paying for it, because paying anything for this P.O.S. game is more then it's worth. No wonder they had to go free to play, no one in there right mind would pay for this crap.

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 06:00 PM
It's soloable, just focus on Arcana, that's what I did.
Although.... For me, Devour essence always helps. :D

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 09:11 PM
Treat it like you do any pet build in a duel. Screw the pets, focus on the master. The key goes away automatically. I've never lost this fight by this method, and I've done it literally at least 75 times on my main, plus at least 20-30 on alts. Now, endbringer...

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 09:23 PM
I've done it twice now. Both toons around level 18. The first toon, a fairly vanilla telepathy build, didn't have any troubles at all. In fact, I didn't realize there was anything tricky about the Arcana fight at all until I tried it with my second toon.

He's a heavy weapons dude with just unranked BCR for heals and had a real hard time dealing with both Arcana and Demon Key at the same time. What didn't work for me was charging in and focusing on Demon Key. Or charging in and focusing on Arcana. Both of those got me killed fairly quickly.

What did work for me, oddly, was doing nothing. I was at the side of the room, against the wall while fighting the riftlings. When the rift went away, Arcana reappeared, flew to the center of the room, and summoned Demon Key. Out of ideas, I just stood there watching by the side wall. Demon Key aggroed on me immediately and flew up to me and attacked. Arcana did not aggro in the least. So I just kicked butt on Demon Key. He's not that tough, 1-on-1. Then when he was down, I took out Arcana, also 1-on-1.

I don't know if it was a fluke, or even just a bug, as I haven't done Resistance a 3rd time yet to test out my theory. But right now, my advice is to be far off to the side while fighting the riftlings, and stay there when Demon Key is summoned, and just let Demon Key come to you.

I'd love to hear how this worked for you, if you try it.

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 09:26 PM
(not to dig up an old thread but this is horrible!)

it takes a level 17 to complete a mission that's level 11! Between this and the "Splinter Cell" like sneaking around quest I did just prior to this one I don't feel very "Super Hero" at all. I feel like I should have played this game more prior to paying for it, because paying anything for this P.O.S. game is more then it's worth. No wonder they had to go free to play, no one in there right mind would pay for this crap.

The mission scales to your level. So in this case it took a level 17 to defeat a level 17 encounter. If you go in at level 11 you face level 11 opposition, at level 40 you see level 40 opposition. All of the Adventure packs scale to your level, and to your team size so you can play it when/how you like.

Archived Post
06-28-2011, 11:30 PM
It's worth noting that not only do the opponents scale to your level, but the rewards (eg items dropped) do as well.

So you should have found you were getting items appropriate for your level.

Archived Post
06-29-2011, 01:11 AM
I feel like I should have played this game more prior to paying for it, because paying anything for this P.O.S. game is more then it's worth. No wonder they had to go free to play, no one in there right mind would pay for this crap.

Yeah, you should play the game more before making statements like this. You have almost no experience with the game and yet you are taking on some of the toughest material in the game. I'd start smaller if I were you and work your way up to soloing Arcana. Try the henchmen in Westside, they seem to be more your speed. Oh, and if that seems to be a little insulting... just think about what you just said about all the people who have subscribed to this game since its original launch date or who have bought lifetime subscriptions.

You can post here on the boards which means you are a gold member with freeform builds available to you. Nobody has any access to powers other than the powers you have access to as a gold member (save maybe for some travel powers that you would have to pay for). There's not a single person in this game that isn't a GM or Developer that has access to any power or build that you do not have access to. Learn how to build characters effectively and how to play those characters. Then maybe your arguments will carry a bit more weight.

Your highest level character is only 13 for crying out loud. You are still crawling around in diapers for all intents and purposes. Learn to walk before you try running a marathon.

Archived Post
06-29-2011, 05:16 PM
My advice, is to read the guides on building an effective character, play different types of characters with different powers, until you find a set that works for you. If one build doesn't work for you, try another build. Arcana is tough, believe me, on one toon, I had to rework the entire build before I could take her solo. Use tactics. Watch how she and the demonflame thing move, how they attack. Sometimes, it might take a couple or even ten times before you bring down a boss. That's the nature of the game and lemme tell you, it feels good when you can bring down a toughie.

Play through the missions. At level thirteen, you really haven't explored the entire game yet, there is something for everyone in it.

Archived Post
07-03-2011, 10:18 PM
My advice, is to read the guides on building an effective character

This is the problem right here. If you don't abuse the power system to cherry pick the ideal powers you are screwed on fights like this. I just came back to the game from a break and made a new character thinking I was going to stick to my concept and avoid the IMBA powers. I didn't have any real trouble up to this point, I had to watch my pulls to not agro a few spawns at once, but other than that smooth sailing. I hit Arcana and she was a brick wall, I didn't have a chance at all. I used henchmen, my full heal CD, and some other devices, all while knowing full well how to defeat her and what to block, and didn't even come close. I got to the demon key stage and that was it, without serious defensive powers and self heals I just died too fast to scratch either her or the key. I could switch to another character with the IMBA powers and beat her with my back to the screen as I watched TV and hit the same key over and over, but I don't want to make another version of THAT character. This fight simply isn't tuned for a normal character, and I'd bet money the vast majority of silver players can't solo this fight at all on their premade characters.

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 06:26 AM
are taking on this segment of the Adv-Pack with low lvl chars. umm, not exactly sure what to say to that. Maybe the way your picking your characters abbilities early on is the reason why your here now with the QQ? Could it be your not focusing on keeping yourself alive rather than 'Ohhh look.. I got a 4th attack and it goes !BooM! XD'

Like some of the others stated, it's not that hard of a fight. I guess when ppl have to 'try' then it's just too much for them to deal with. Good thing real life isn't like this. Imagine all the quitters we'd have laying around at home waiting for their monthly.....Oh right. Forgot who i'm dealing with >.<

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 07:15 AM
The main issue IMHO is that the Adventure Packs as a whole really shouldn't be run before level 20ish, unless you have a very optimized well rounded build.

The APs are expecting that you'll have the basics like an AoE attack, a heal, and ways to deal with lots of guys and/or powerful bosses attacking you. Below level 20, unless you've played the game before and built specific powerful characters, odds are you're simply not going to have the tools needed to get far.

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 08:54 AM
This is the problem right here. If you don't abuse the power system to cherry pick the ideal powers you are screwed on fights like this. I just came back to the game from a break and made a new character thinking I was going to stick to my concept and avoid the IMBA powers. I didn't have any real trouble up to this point, I had to watch my pulls to not agro a few spawns at once, but other than that smooth sailing. I hit Arcana and she was a brick wall, I didn't have a chance at all. I used henchmen, my full heal CD, and some other devices, all while knowing full well how to defeat her and what to block, and didn't even come close. I got to the demon key stage and that was it, without serious defensive powers and self heals I just died too fast to scratch either her or the key. I could switch to another character with the IMBA powers and beat her with my back to the screen as I watched TV and hit the same key over and over, but I don't want to make another version of THAT character. This fight simply isn't tuned for a normal character, and I'd bet money the vast majority of silver players can't solo this fight at all on their premade characters.

That's not exactly true. I beat her with a force character using PFF, IDF, Force Shield, Field Surge, and Force Blast. Nothing at all in that list was cherry picked, they all came straight out of the force power set. The first two phases of the fight were easy, just blast away at Arcana until she summons the rift then blast the riftlings and touch the energy they leave behind. Nearly any build can do that part. It is the last phase of the fight that's the tough one. When she summons the Demon Key, use full charges of Force Blast to hit it as hard as possible, block to regain energy/block the lifedrain effect, then resume full charges of Force Blast. The Key will go down pretty quick. Use Field Surge whenever PFF gets too low. Once the key is gone, block to recharge PFF and/or just keep blasting Arcana. Without the key she's nothing.

And that was done with PFF, the passive that nearly everyone, including me, agrees is the most useless passive in the entire game.

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 09:02 AM
This is the problem right here. If you don't abuse the power system to cherry pick the ideal powers you are screwed on fights like this.

That's simply not true. If you deliberately or unknowingly create a very poor, very gimped character I can see how a tough boss fight would be impossible without help.

However I've completed this fight on harder difficulties even with some undeniably sub-par characters (ice form, PFF etc) and it is doable.

No doubt it's easier to faceroll Arcana with an enrage tank, but claiming you need to abuse the system just to win the fight suggests you don't know a thing about the system or the fight.

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 12:56 PM
That's not exactly true. I beat her with a force character using PFF, IDF, Force Shield, Field Surge, and Force Blast. Nothing at all in that list was cherry picked, they all came straight out of the force power set. The first two phases of the fight were easy, just blast away at Arcana until she summons the rift then blast the riftlings and touch the energy they leave behind. Nearly any build can do that part. It is the last phase of the fight that's the tough one. When she summons the Demon Key, use full charges of Force Blast to hit it as hard as possible, block to regain energy/block the lifedrain effect, then resume full charges of Force Blast. The Key will go down pretty quick. Use Field Surge whenever PFF gets too low. Once the key is gone, block to recharge PFF and/or just keep blasting Arcana. Without the key she's nothing.

And that was done with PFF, the passive that nearly everyone, including me, agrees is the most useless passive in the entire game.

I'm not part of nearly everyone I guess, I have a force character and PFF has it's uses. The fight here is attrition based, PFF can triple your survival time in a fight, while offensive passives will only let you do ~50% more damage. For anything that doesn't die in a couple seconds, the defensive passives are far and away better than the offensive ones for solo PvE, even PFF.

That's like the first rule of the game, if you don't want to die a lot and run into bosses you can't beat solo, you need a defensive passive. You can wipe out easy mobs with an offensive passive really fast and feel great about it, but then you make the slightest mistake like pulling an extra spawn and you faceplant right there (unless you have a few emergency abilities, which isn't the case at low levels). PFF is sort of crappy compared to regen, defiance, or LR, but it's still better than an offensive passive and will allow you to get things done, albeit with slightly more challenge.

Essentially you hit level 8 and have to decide between being a terrible character and picking the passive you want, or being a good character and grabbing LR, regen, or defiance, because without one of those the game is 10 times harder. Again all related to solo play, offensives are great in a balanced group.

Archived Post
07-05-2011, 04:33 PM
There's nothing in the PvE game that can't be handled just fine on Elite, with an offensive passive if you bother to put some thought into how you build your character.

The only things that require a defensive passive when soloing are attempts to tackle content that is intended for groups. I'm not sure soloing Mandragalore is possible with say, electric form or kinetic manipulation. However for any of the adventure packs or any of the normal missions, it's completely doable.

PvP is a whole other issue, as are Archtypes since they aren't allowed to take a lot of the abilities that cover an offensive passives weaknesses like the active defenses and such.

Archived Post
07-07-2011, 01:54 AM
There's nothing in the PvE game that can't be handled just fine on Elite, with an offensive passive if you bother to put some thought into how you build your character.

And we are back to cherry picking. Ya sure, we could all pick BCR and Masterful Dodge and use those on every single boss fight.

I do put thought into my characters, but that thought is aimed toward their concept and picking powers that fit into their theme with as little bending as possible. I don't sit there and think about how many overpowered skills I can stack onto a single character. I do have characters that can solo legendaries, but there's only so many concepts you can fit powers like that into, and only so many times you can do that before it becomes horribly boring.

Archived Post
07-07-2011, 02:40 AM
There's nothing in the PvE game that can't be handled just fine on Elite, with an offensive passive if you bother to put some thought into how you build your character.

The only things that require a defensive passive when soloing are attempts to tackle content that is intended for groups. I'm not sure soloing Mandragalore is possible with say, electric form or kinetic manipulation. However for any of the adventure packs or any of the normal missions, it's completely doable.

PvP is a whole other issue, as are Archtypes since they aren't allowed to take a lot of the abilities that cover an offensive passives weaknesses like the active defenses and such.

Ok, from the other end of the spectrum, this too is not exactly true. Try Arcana at a lower level like 11-15 with an offensive passive on elite. This is before you have the wide variety of extra powers available to a high level toon. Even a well designed offensive character at that level is going to have a very difficult, if not impossible time with Arcana.

Archived Post
07-07-2011, 02:44 AM
... PFF has it's uses....

You are right. No power is completely useless... It can always serve as a bad example.

Archived Post
07-07-2011, 08:37 AM
And we are back to cherry picking. Ya sure, we could all pick BCR and Masterful Dodge and use those on every single boss fight.

I do put thought into my characters, but that thought is aimed toward their concept and picking powers that fit into their theme with as little bending as possible. I don't sit there and think about how many overpowered skills I can stack onto a single character. I do have characters that can solo legendaries, but there's only so many concepts you can fit powers like that into, and only so many times you can do that before it becomes horribly boring.


You're arguing a false dichotomy. There is a middle ground between avoiding every possible defensive and utility power to produce a gimpy character and cherry picking to produce an overpowered one.

All of my characters fall into this middle spectrum. I don't have a single character (out of 30+ toons) who qualify as a FOTM or cherry picked build.

If you pick nothing but tier-zero attacks and take medical nanites as your passive the game will be very difficult to play. I grant you that.

Archived Post
07-07-2011, 08:39 AM
Ok, from the other end of the spectrum, this too is not exactly true. Try Arcana at a lower level like 11-15 with an offensive passive on elite. This is before you have the wide variety of extra powers available to a high level toon. Even a well designed offensive character at that level is going to have a very difficult, if not impossible time with Arcana.

Yeah, you're right. I don't think I've ever bumped a character up to elite missions before level 20 or so. But Resistance is still quite doable at level 11 with a weak character, you just might need to buy some mars stims or craft the equivalent. Particularly with Cell Block D being glitched to keep you from healing out of combat.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 11:38 AM
You're arguing a false dichotomy. There is a middle ground between avoiding every possible defensive and utility power to produce a gimpy character and cherry picking to produce an overpowered one.

All of my characters fall into this middle spectrum. I don't have a single character (out of 30+ toons) who qualify as a FOTM or cherry picked build.

If you pick nothing but tier-zero attacks and take medical nanites as your passive the game will be very difficult to play. I grant you that.

Ok, how about this? Go solo this mission using the Blade or Devastator ATs. Let me know how that works out for you.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 11:51 AM
Ok, how about this? Go solo this mission using the Blade or Devastator ATs. Let me know how that works out for you.

When playing an AT I leave the difficulty on normal, because that's what AT's are designed for. And they play just fine. They solo just fine.

It's possible that you're actually quite bad at this game, if it's really that hard for you. Because I'm telling you, I play all kinds of characters, some of them extremely gimped by anyone's standards, and the PvE content is simply not difficult. And I know for a fact that I am a mediocre player at best (PvP has taught me just how poor my skills are compared to the people who play extremely well).

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 12:06 PM
When playing an AT I leave the difficulty on normal, because that's what AT's are designed for. And they play just fine. They solo just fine.

You'll note I did not say elite, anywhere in this thread for that matter. Try it on normal.

I'll ignore most of your other comments due to their obviously offensive nature. Most of the PvE content in this game is a joke and can be solo'd without any passives at all, as long as you don't over pull. Then there are mission bosses like this one and a few others that will just instantly crush characters that don't have the "right" skills.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 12:21 PM
You'll note I did not say elite, anywhere in this thread for that matter. Try it on normal.

I'll ignore most of your other comments due to their obviously offensive nature. Most of the PvE content in this game is a joke and can be solo'd without any passives at all, as long as you don't over pull. Then there are mission bosses like this one and a few others that will just instantly crush characters that don't have the "right" skills.

I've done it on normal with just eyebeams and laser sword at level 11. I had to use a health recovery item (one of them). The fight isn't that hard. If you can't beat it, the problem is you, not the game, and some of the content will be closed to you unless you have a team to carry you. If you wanted to take offense to that, be my guest. But I'm not trolling you, and honestly your insistence that this mission is overly hard (even on normal difficulty) is starting to feel like you trolling me.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 12:40 PM
I've done it on normal with just eyebeams and laser sword at level 11. I had to use a health recovery item (one of them).

No you didn't, and you just discredited everything you've said on the subject. I don't even think you know what fight this thread is about.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 01:00 PM
No you didn't, and you just discredited everything you've said on the subject. I don't even think you know what fight this thread is about.

LMAO.

Warden Arcana in resistance, and yes, yes I did. Level 11 joke power armor character that I wanted to get to the colossi farm as fast as possible.

I'm sorry you find this one fight so challenging, but really it's not. I wonder what you're doing so horribly wrong during the fight. Are you not blocking the schtick attacks? Do you stand in the middle of the room taking rift damage during phase 2? Do you fail to separate the demon key and Arcana during phase 3?

What is your strategy that is not working?

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 02:05 PM
I tried it on a level 12 heavy weapons character with unstoppable and guard. I got past the rift stage without taking any real damage, with henchmen out. I could go all out on her or the key, block all major attacks while retaliating with extra damage from guard, and could not significantly damage either of them before dying. Even using a vet full heal. Attacking her I could get her to drain the key once or twice. Attacking the key I could get it to half health.

I'm sure I could have exploited and hugged the wall to face pull one of them and split the encounter, but I like my account in good standing and people have been banned for similar things in other games. It's obvious they are meant to be fought together, and half of my characters have no trouble doing so.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 02:16 PM
I tried it on a level 12 heavy weapons character with unstoppable and guard. I got past the rift stage without taking any real damage, with henchmen out. I could go all out on her or the key, block all major attacks while retaliating with extra damage from guard, and could not significantly damage either of them before dying. Even using a vet full heal. Attacking her I could get her to drain the key once or twice. Attacking the key I could get it to half health.

I'm sure I could have exploited and hugged the wall to face pull one of them and split the encounter, but I like my account in good standing and people have been banned for similar things in other games. It's obvious they are meant to be fought together, and half of my characters have no trouble doing so.

Whelp, level 11 defiance/energy shield (both R1) eyebeams! (R3!) and lasor sword R2 I managed the fight, barely, but I did split them up and fight them separately. Vet heal was on cooldown because cell block D is bugged to keep you from healing out of combat and I almost died getting through it, had to settle for a stim against Arcana, which I used in phase 3 against the Key. The fight is completely doable with a decent character (rank 3 eyebeams is the exact opposite of decent, this is literally the lamest character I've ever rolled) and it's hard as hell at low level with a bad one. But with even two more levels the character in question would have had a second superstat and the fight would have been trivial.

I think it's unreasonable to expect adventure packs to be balanced for a character that doesn't have their second superstat. Sure you get access at level 11, but what about the other 27 levels?. I'll settle for very difficult 11-12 in exchange for it not being stupidly easy 13-40.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 03:10 PM
Whelp, level 11 defiance

Um, I think you missed the key point of my argument. :p

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 03:26 PM
Um, I think you missed the key point of my argument. :p

I think you missed my entire point. You see "defiant" and you assume the character is overpowered. I gave you the whole build. Go ahead and roll up a defiant/laser sword/eyebeams character and dump all your rank points into eyebeams. Let me know how awesome it works out for you because of your passive.

Maybe having a decent defensive passive makes all the difference in that brief gap between where APs first become available and when characters start to pick up in the mid-teens.

I don't know, that's the only time I've taken a pre-teen into Resistance and it wasn't super fun. But I can roll in there with a teens avenger character and have a blast, and have done so many times.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 03:52 PM
Even with rank 1 defiance the difference is night and day. Defiance is overpowered, so it instantly makes any character it's on overpowered, your other skills are irrelevant. All you need to make a successful character is grab defiance, regen, or invulnerabilty, they don't need any help or synergies from other powers to make your character work, you can probably just rank up your energy builder and solo everything with that. If you grab any other passive then you really need to look for synergies and get the right combo of powers to make it work (and in many cases this will break your theme) and it will still be more difficult than with a good defensive passive.

I left out LR because by itself at lower levels it's not actually that fantastic.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 04:04 PM
Even with rank 1 defiance the difference is night and day. Defiance is overpowered, so it instantly makes any character it's on overpowered, your other skills are irrelevant. All you need to make a successful character is grab defiance, regen, or invulnerabilty, they don't need any help or synergies from other powers to make your character work, you can probably just rank up your energy builder and solo everything with that. If you grab any other passive then you really need to look for synergies and get the right combo of powers to make it work (and in many cases this will break your theme) and it will still be more difficult than with a good defensive passive.

I left out LR because by itself at lower levels it's not actually that fantastic.

I have never found it difficult to make great characters with most of the passives available. The only passives that have flat out failed to delight me have been a couple of the auras, targeting computer, old molecular self-assembly, and post-nerf unstoppable. Even the much maligned PFF, I use on my main and he works rather well for what I built him to do. As far as Defiance being OP, well, it's not hard to kill a Defiant character who doesn't have any self-healing capability (such as a low level, or poorly-designed one).

Even with Unstoppable being kind of crummy, I am sure I could take an offensive melee through Resistance on normal difficulty starting at level 13. I've certainly done it with WoTW. And the part I would die on and complain about wouldn't be Arcana, it would be Endbringer, who is far more difficult for melees than Arcana.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 08:45 PM
I'm sure I could have exploited and hugged the wall to face pull one of them and split the encounter, but I like my account in good standing and people have been banned for similar things in other games. It's obvious they are meant to be fought together, and half of my characters have no trouble doing so.

Not to derail things, but... is there any reason to suppose that splitting the encounter would be considered an exploit? It isn't obvious to me that they are meant to be fought together, but of course I've only been playing for a couple months. Has someone official posted about it or something?

It doesn't seem any different than, say, the final Serpent Lantern encounter, where you can peel the Serpent Mage off from the Spirit Serpent and fight two separate 1-on-1 battles instead of a tougher 1-on-2 fight. Doesn't seem like an exploit so much as good tactics -- don't bite off more than you can chew.

Archived Post
07-08-2011, 09:03 PM
Not to derail things, but... is there any reason to suppose that splitting the encounter would be considered an exploit? It isn't obvious to me that they are meant to be fought together, but of course I've only been playing for a couple months. Has someone official posted about it or something?

It doesn't seem any different than, say, the final Serpent Lantern encounter, where you can peel the Serpent Mage off from the Spirit Serpent and fight two separate 1-on-1 battles instead of a tougher 1-on-2 fight. Doesn't seem like an exploit so much as good tactics -- don't bite off more than you can chew.

Using line of sight in and of itself isn't an exploit. Forcing a boss to glitch or bug out is.

Currently Warden Arcana doesn't aggro on the player at the beginning of phase 3, but the Demon Key does, so simply standing a short distance away from them at the beginning of the phase will result in the Key moving to the player to attack while Arcana patiently waits her turn. This is a bug, and has been reported (by me) on the forums. Aside from that bug however, there is plenty of geometry in the room to break line of sight on the bosses, and if we weren't intended to use cover during the fight then they wouldn't have given us any.

So are we required to shoot something at Arcana at the beginning of phase three because her aggro is broken? No. There's nothing in the rules anywhere that says we're required to aggro a mob that isn't aggroing on us.

I'm sure she'll be fixed soon, but in the meantime, not intentionally aggroing her isn't an exploit. Once she is fixed, by all means duck and weave around the large prison console in the back half of the room. There's a reason there's enough space there for us to move around it.

Archived Post
07-09-2011, 09:39 AM
Currently Warden Arcana doesn't aggro on the player at the beginning of phase 3

Actually she does. I even did a few tests today on another character and she (and the key) will immediately come after you after the portal pops and she summons the key, even if you are as far away as you can possibly get on that stage (I tried from near the door thinking I could get a few seconds break). It is a single fight with 3 phases, you never lose agro with the boss. You can't even leave combat on that floor from the moment you enter it. I don't know how anyone has managed to split them, but it involves bugs, and ones that don't show up every time or have been fixed since some of you have tried it.

BTW, I took a level 21 force character with invuln and IDF through the missions on normal and even she had serious trouble with that boss, the only way I could finish it was by blocking for 80 seconds at a time as Field Surge recharged. Once it came up I'd have a few seconds to attack her, usually enough to get her to drain the key once, and then I'd have to block again, the two of them just do too much damage. Also blocking doesn't prevent the key from healing itself, the damage and heal portions of his drain aren't linked, if you can't do incredibly fast damage you have zero chance of killing the key and need to just focus on Arcana and make her drain it until it's gone.

Archived Post
07-09-2011, 01:00 PM
Actually she does.

If so then they fixed it in the last patch, because earlier this week she wasn't aggroing.

I'm glad she's fixed, it was a bug (and as I said, I reported it in the patch notes bug thread).

That said, there's nothing sploity about using the cover in the room.

Archived Post
07-14-2011, 02:00 PM
This is frikkin insane :/ I am stuck for like an hour now, keep dying and dying. One kick from her or her buddy and I am dead. And my health does not regenerate.
I need to start looking more carefully if the mission is an adventure pack, as I spent like 3 hours going through sewers and prisons with task list being written on toilet paper and running out of space. And finally after all this I end up in the impossible to win fight. Ok I somehow manage to kick her around, then that portal thingy started, done that as well, had like 80% of health left. And then she summons that devil thing and I am gone :/ Don't even last 30 second :/
I even had a device which summons for me a shooter, which will take all the enemy attention away, but still no chance :/

Archived Post
07-15-2011, 03:14 AM
Inanely hard fight, but only because of the no regeneration of health bug. That was really annoying. If I just had a few healing items with me I could take her on with only a little excessive difficulty. And this is with a level 12 inferno themed character. Flight helps a LOT against the rift critters as they cannot hit you if you are at the ceiling. As it is I can almost beat her. I hate that I will have to start the prison all over again though. But it is a fun time.

Archived Post
07-15-2011, 03:27 AM
Inanely hard fight, but only because of the no regeneration of health bug. That was really annoying. If I just had a few healing items with me I could take her on with only a little excessive difficulty. And this is with a level 12 inferno themed character. Flight helps a LOT against the rift critters as they cannot hit you if you are at the ceiling. As it is I can almost beat her. I hate that I will have to start the prison all over again though. But it is a fun time.

Yesterday after my 1st post I retried the fight, done the prison, and went on to fight. before that I shuffled some of the items to balance my character out. And during the prison I reached level 19. And as soon as I stepped to fight arcane, got my ass kicked in 20 seconds :/ have no time even to figure out what am I being hit by.

Archived Post
07-17-2011, 11:20 PM
After getting her into phase three, back into one of the alcoves next to the computers at the back of the room. She'll turn and agro you, start shooting stuff at you but the key will just stand there and wait for her to drain it to death. Easy fight once I figured that out.

Archived Post
07-24-2011, 10:19 PM
How do you fight the warden as a ranged person? :rolleyes:
My character flys and so she stays above the spawned mobs and they cannot hurt her. :p
She cannot hurt the Warden when she is in the rift mode because she is immune all of my attacks. :(
My character cannot survive in melee range and since she is Celestial she can keep herself healed indefinitely. But since she cannot attack the Warden and after killing over 100 pets I determined that it was not viable for her to kill them we are at a impasse; what do we do to win this? :confused:

Archived Post
07-24-2011, 11:19 PM
pull separate for me, which is good since I'm forced to enter that fight with reduced stars or half HP.

Archived Post
07-24-2011, 11:38 PM
How do you fight the warden as a ranged person? :rolleyes:
My character flys and so she stays above the spawned mobs and they cannot hurt her. :p
She cannot hurt the Warden when she is in the rift mode because she is immune all of my attacks. :(
My character cannot survive in melee range and since she is Celestial she can keep herself healed indefinitely. But since she cannot attack the Warden and after killing over 100 pets I determined that it was not viable for her to kill them we are at a impasse; what do we do to win this? :confused:

During Phase 2 you kill Riftlings. When a Riftling dies it leaves a hovering purple cloud. When a player walks into it the cloud flies into the center of the room and damages the rift.

It takes 4 Riftlings to end phase 2, solo, on elite. Not sure about teams.

There was a bug right after the kitchen sink patch where the riftlings didn't spawn clouds when they died and phase 2 couldn't be beaten.

However, that was patched a while back and I haven't seen that bug since, and I do a lot of Resistance.

Additionally, if you fight the final riftling in one of the corners behind the big computer thingy you can still split Arcana and the demon up in phase 3. It's harder, but not that hard. Even if you can't split them up (or won't, because you feel it's an exploit) it is easy enough to kite the demon while you fight Arcana, his ranged attacks are not really that powerful and it keeps you away from his Devour Essence.

For that matter, if you have a 100' ranged attack Arcana herself is easy to kite, and the only attack you have to deal with of hers is the Shadow Blast, which hits hard but has a lengthy wind up. I've run circles around her spamming shurikens and the fight becomes hilariously easy once you take her big hold and her obnoxious pbaoe knockback out of the equation.

Archived Post
07-26-2011, 12:40 AM
That worked, in fact killing her was easy after I learned to just kill the spawn and then step in to it's puddle. :)

It was weird that the monster key thing attacked me but the warden ignored me. :rolleyes:

The last battle was a pain, I tried to kill all of the shadow crystals and then beat on endgiver (or whatever his name was). Took a long time but eventually I won. :D

Archived Post
07-26-2011, 05:06 PM
I just did this, a very satisfying boss fight! Persist and hope there are some health drops, that's what I did.

Archived Post
08-02-2011, 01:37 PM
I have a problem in this fight. My support drones are not healing me. Is this a bug or is it intended? Not one problem during the entire run on Resistance elite up until this point (I even got a Dark Speed drop!) and now I can't go on because Arcana instantly hits me with that ooze which won't let me attack or block and by the time I'm free I have next to no health and my stupid drones won't heal me.

Archived Post
08-02-2011, 01:49 PM
I have a problem in this fight. My support drones are not healing me. Is this a bug or is it intended? Not one problem during the entire run on Resistance elite up until this point (I even got a Dark Speed drop!) and now I can't go on because Arcana instantly hits me with that ooze which won't let me attack or block and by the time I'm free I have next to no health and my stupid drones won't heal me.

Resummon your drones immediately after she uses her aoe hold. Unless she's charging Shadow Bolt, in which case block first.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 12:16 AM
Arcana is one of the 'easier' encounters in this place, even on Elite. Arguably, The conqueror jet bomb mission (if not glitched), Pulling Oubliette and Lapis into the bunker before they get mobbed by MegaDs (which is really a 100% optional way of doing that fight, as even a single tap on both of them gives you loot), and some of the jailhouse missions that require you kill stuff while in power replace mode are tougher, albeit to varying degrees. (The Conqueror's Jet mission especially is actually challenging on Elite because it demands some great kiting skills if you don't have a 100 range attack.)

Couple of tips:
Health Regen is a plus. There will be a lot of short persistent damage ticks.
Kill the adds she spawns during the rift phase on top of the rift. Use the rift to regen energy quickly by stepping into it with your block on. It's easy to do a little dance here.. it's sort of like the hokey pokey. Riftling comes out, you come in. Once the riftling dies, block for a second or so to regen your energy, then go out until the next riftling pops.
Stay Mobile and be aware of powerup drops. This is very important if you're running mostly offensive passives/active offenses.

Use an ability that hits BOTH Arcana AND the Key. This speeds up the encounter a fair amount.
The biggest help though for Arcana is a short cd heal and a defensive passive. (LR, Defiance, Invuln, even Regeneration or AoPM/AoRP help)

If you're looking for a real challenge, do the first sabotage mission (plant bombs and confiscate weapons) without activating the helper NPCs on Elite while soloing. I have yet to be able to pull that little trick off, but I've got a feeling a good tanking pet might make it doable.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 11:09 AM
If you're looking for a real challenge, do the first sabotage mission (plant bombs and confiscate weapons) without activating the helper NPCs on Elite while soloing. I have yet to be able to pull that little trick off, but I've got a feeling a good tanking pet might make it doable.

Meh, I didn't find that challenging at all. I always kill all the mobs by myself and only call the NPCs when I finish to make sure I can go on with the mission. That's the problem with these missions. You can't have one character which is good for everything. Either you have problems with the mobs or you have them with the bosses.

Again, my problem is that Arcana instantly attacks me with that rooting attack which won't let me move or attack and also affects my healing drones. By the time I get free, I have too little health and get killed almost instantly.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 12:22 PM
Meh, I didn't find that challenging at all. I always kill all the mobs by myself and only call the NPCs when I finish to make sure I can go on with the mission. That's the problem with these missions. You can't have one character which is good for everything. Either you have problems with the mobs or you have them with the bosses.

Again, my problem is that Arcana instantly attacks me with that rooting attack which won't let me move or attack and also affects my healing drones. By the time I get free, I have too little health and get killed almost instantly.

Her hold has a 50' range. Just move out of range while she's charging it, or block. You'll usually be held anyway while blocking, but it cuts the health of the hold by a substantial amount.

Then resummon your drones.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 08:41 PM
Hmm vets talking about how easy it is to play on Elite. Do you remember what is was like when you started? ;)

I found this amazingly hard and have not yet passed. I used my Firepower character to go through Res. had little trouble until Block D. Keeping the badies at bay while the girl frees the scientist (cannot remember the names right now) I cannot do these encounters with firepower, he just cannot kill quick enough and they just keep growing in numbers. (same trouble in the desert defending there too. I have had concerns as stated above that if I do not chose the right powers, I cannot pass. I chose my powers from a rollplay pov, not a strategic one. For me Champions PnP was brilliant this way, and any character idea could be balanced. I have taken that into this game. This is not the case here, at least not with my knowledge of how the powers work)

Up to Arcana it took me about 4-5 hours.

Fighting arcana I had similar difficulties as above, I tried to fight her about another 5 hours straight and could not beat her. I am pretty new, and not very good I must admit. I did not pick up on the clouds the henchman leave in stage 2, I would manage to defeat 2 of them before retreating to the end of the hallway and healing. Finally stage 3 would start and I managed to last about 30 seconds. Even from right down the end of the hall, I have Arcanas attention immediately each time I tried, I didn't even make it lhlaf way down the hall before I was dead, both enemies beating me hard.

Not knowing that I could come back into resitance at this point, I did not want to give up, but finally had to as I had been playing for 36 hours straight (first week playing, I was hooked). I tried first time at about level 13 I think, and then tried again at level 19. I was happy to find that I only had to do the cell block section rather than the whole AP, but at cell block D had the regen bug that stayed with me through arcana making it impossible. Again I could not beat her. I have not wanted to try again because this really upset me and posted a bug report straight away.

but now I have a few tips I might try again.

Im having real trouble with another character now on the Viper Island AP stuck at Draconis. I cannot even get his force shield down past 50% using several devices. Guess I just have to learn how to play better before doing any more APs.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 09:09 PM
It helps if you're higher level. The Adventure Packs are flat out harder than all the normal content. Also, I've never ever said that resistance is easy on elite for a level 19 character. Resistance is challenging on normal for most characters in their teens. It's possible to solo it on elite at your level, but not with any old build.

Since you're a new player, there's no reason to skip all the normal missions and head into the Adventure Packs at such a low level, the "vets" do a lot of APs because we are bored silly with the normal mission content which we've done 20, 30, 40 or 50+ times or more.

Take a deep breath, step back, find the super jet and fly to Canada or the Desert and do some normal missions.

The loot drops in the APs are better than normal mission rewards, but they don't start getting remarkably better until level 30+. There is just no reason ever to spend 5 hours beating yourself against a brick wall when you could be doing something completely enjoyable elsewhere that will give you a sense of completion and progress.

And by the way, there is another thread floating around here in which a number of vets were commenting on how ridiculously difficult the Draconis fight is, for them, at level 40, compared to most of the rest of the game. So don't be surprised you can't beat him at level 19. He knocks you into the lightning field, you die. The fight is nasty like that.

Archived Post
08-03-2011, 09:24 PM
Thx for the quick reply. Knowing this about Draconis, I might jump out of that for now and come back later.

I don't feel half as defeated now :cool:


The main reason I jumped into these so early was the request from Defender to quick come and help. It felt as if the game was saying, "ok, you're ready for this now."

Still a very enjoyable experience - "Pain is so close to pleasure"

Archived Post
01-10-2012, 02:08 AM
I just soloed it this morning on elite, so it's soloable. The requirement is met. *shrugs*

I managed to solo it yesterday, but I don't know how. Sheer luck I suppose. Even then it took about 30+ attempts. I'm probably on attempt #100 the second time around and am on the verge of saying 'F$%# it" until this gets fixed. It's DEFINITELY broken.

So your attempt at false bravado is ignored.

Archived Post
01-10-2012, 02:15 AM
17820

Quick, my shotgun!

Archived Post
01-10-2012, 04:44 AM
I'm not part of nearly everyone I guess, I have a force character and PFF has it's uses. The fight here is attrition based, PFF can triple your survival time in a fight, while offensive passives will only let you do ~50% more damage. For anything that doesn't die in a couple seconds, the defensive passives are far and away better than the offensive ones for solo PvE, even PFF.

That's like the first rule of the game, if you don't want to die a lot and run into bosses you can't beat solo, you need a defensive passive. You can wipe out easy mobs with an offensive passive really fast and feel great about it, but then you make the slightest mistake like pulling an extra spawn and you faceplant right there (unless you have a few emergency abilities, which isn't the case at low levels). PFF is sort of crappy compared to regen, defiance, or LR, but it's still better than an offensive passive and will allow you to get things done, albeit with slightly more challenge.

Essentially you hit level 8 and have to decide between being a terrible character and picking the passive you want, or being a good character and grabbing LR, regen, or defiance, because without one of those the game is 10 times harder. Again all related to solo play, offensives are great in a balanced group.

Thats not true because any good offensive PVE character has at least spend some points in a block replacer. I have a lvl 40 Qularr Bioengineer using dual pistol with Pestilence as passive and I can solo Overseer Megadestroids (on elite) just with 3 skills, Pestilence, Holdout Shot and Retallion R3. And who knows how crap pestilence can be when it's about survival. I don't tell me I cherry best skill in game because my choice is far from the best.

A fight is not only about bursting a boss until it dies, you can be very effective when you anticipate attacks and TAP block to parry attacks. And thats way more mitigation than a defensive passive while keeping a relative high offensive bonus. Also in the case of Arcana fight the Demon keys is limited to melee to restaure health and Arcana channels her heal while she absorb the Demon Key's energy, so it is very possible to take almost no damage just be using your brains in the third phase of this fight.

Also experiencing both offensive and defensive way I have found my Avenger builds average better to get trough elite content very fast while a defensive user sure is easy mode but still take more time to finish content on his own.

I think the games offers a relative high diversity and makes a lot of succesfull available build for PVE, even on elite. The only difference is some requiere more strategy and skill than others to compete on the same level of effectiveness.

kinggo4
08-01-2012, 09:26 AM
every time i try to defeat warden arcana i lose she's so strong and why she calls DEMON key he's more strong than she is i advice the game creators to make that level easy :smile::biggrin:

lotar295
08-01-2012, 09:44 AM
if you need help on her,the thing is you beat her up,she'll use the summoned thing's strenght to heal herself,eaking the summoned thingy,then the summoned thing gets so weak you can kill it in 1 hit,then focus on the warden

flyingfinn
08-01-2012, 11:27 AM
The above statement made no sense to me.....

But anyway. Leave DemonKey alone. Just dmg Arcana.
And another thing. The lil black orbs that the smaller summon demons drop, you touch them and Arcana gets damaged.

draugadan
09-12-2012, 08:07 PM
Ok, I just beat all the riftlings, got past stage 2, beat the demon and then started to pound on her and then she turned back into the rift and I am fighting riftlings again. Only this time they only spawn if I walk into the rift. Wow... talk about frustrating.

Edit: I've been doing this for awhile now, and can't seem to get the rift below 1,680 hp. grrr... what a waste of my time.

Edit: I have finally given up. It took I don't know how many riftlings to kill the Rift this time. Then I killed the demon and started to hit Arcana. A rift appeared but I could still hit her. So... I did. Except that as I hit her, with a lot of knock, she would move and open another rift. Before giving up I had 3 rifts open. Wow... I want my time back. That sucked.