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View Full Version : Did Cryptic / Atari do something to annoy Massively?


Archived Post
03-18-2010, 02:54 PM
Did Cryptic / Atari do something to directly annoy Massively.com...?
I've noticed quite a few rather anti-Cryptic (company and games) articles lately from more than one writer on that site. And it's tied to the Joystiq family of websites (although Joystiq is not exactly the greatest gaming info source but they're still very well known).

For Cryptic, including this recent one titled:
The Daily Grind: What do you think of Cryptic?
http://www.massively.com/2010/03/18/the-daily-grind-what-do-you-think-of-cryptic/

Maybe I'm taking it the wrong way, but it's kind of a loaded question to put up as the article title...? Seems like it's trying to attract flames / hate.

(Also check out that close up picture of Bill Roper on the top bar there... kind of unflattering to say the least).

Not exactly the greatest press the game can receive........

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 03:43 PM
I prefer MMORPG.com because they stay away from gossip and excessive negativity, in general for all games. I believe this is because they want all MMORPGs to find success, since it is good for the industry over all.

Massively, on the other hand, seems to likely controversy and flame-wars to generate more page views. Take a look at this article from February 21st:

Champions Online gives a mini-state of the game (http://www.massively.com/2010/02/21/champions-online-gives-a-mini-state-of-the-game/)

A mini-SotG? In the article itself they call it a "pint-sized SotG." Reading a bit further we see Revelations described as a mini-expansion. :confused:

The article keeps bringing up ancient history:

Their initial plan for a paid mini-expansion met with a reception that could best be described as "frothing rage," and even their later reversal didn't exactly calm the waters.

Now, I know some players are probably still upset over what initially went down with VB (sadly, it seems many folks on the forums will "never be the same" as before that announcement). That said, in the broader audience of gamers there is going to be left-over confusion about what are the facts, and IMO Massively is just playing off of this confusion with the above quote. Why do we need to keep bringing up mistakes when they were corrected in-time before anyone was charged, etc?

Imagine a gamer who is checking out CO, and never caught the original VibPay story. They are going to click the link about "frothing rage" above, and read all this negative stuff that is totally unnecessary because the problem was fixed. At this point that frothing rage is only interesting as gossip. This is worse than crying over spilled milk, they have already wiped it up and poured you a new one, to keep bringing up the spill as news is...irresponsible for a journalism site.

Again, subsequent posters could easily attack the points I am making. Afterall, what Massively has presented are facts. I am just saying they are irresponsible to keep bringing up the VB pay issues after it has become a non-issue. In contrast, MMORPG.com has done their best to clarify that the expansion is now totally free. For example they put the clarification directly in the summaries of subsequent interviews with Bill Roper, as they should, because it is an important point.

Sorry for the wall of text, but at this point I am seeing far too many people say things like "by all accounts Cryptic's games are bad." Once people who haven't even played the games start spreading the "news" that they are bad, the anti-hype has gone too far. All MMOs have a steep learning curve, and if someone already thinks the game is bad then it is hard for them to give it a fair shot: the game will seem worse because the player will be resistant to learning, thinking they probably won't stick with it anyway.

A really refreshing thing for me has been to read the thread where we vote for Cryptic in The Escapist (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/532.179841-Poll-Round-1-East-4-Cryptic-Studios-vs-13-NAMCO-BANDAI) tournament. The refreshing thing is to see opinions from a less hardcore demographic. It got me thinking about the extent to which the way I see MMOs is different from the broader market, and it is based on these considerations that I am calling Massively's Cryptic coverage irresponsible.

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 03:59 PM
To be fair, I don't mind MMO-centric sites covering all the bits and pieces going on, good and bad for a MMO, because people should be made aware. I thought some of the previous articles on Massively were ok, although touched with subjective commentary. Of course, that is due to "news" and "blogs" being merged into this annoying form of new media.

It's why I detest sites like Kotaku, a collection of personal blogs masquerading as a video game news site done in blog format. It makes it worse when networks like CNBC use the personal opinions of the writers there as some kind of "experts" on the industry when it's really just their personal opinions. It's also humorous because they "control" their comments section by promoting only comments they like instead of just moderating it. But because the site is so big and well known, even Sony PR reps have to kiss up to them. I hate when soap box / grand standing takes over for real news.

For the site in question (Massively), I've read previous articles on CO and Cryptic on Massively and I didn't find them all that bad. Some of the articles are blogs as well (although not clearly labelled as such), and the article you pointed out was in the midst of the ViboraPay debacle so it was kind of to be expected (MMORPG had a similar article with a similar tone).

But this recent one, I don't see the point in it, nor have I seen an article that is comparable on their site for other MMO companies who dropped the ball / have controversy (and really which company doesn't have at least some controversy?). It's pretty much begging all the negative haters to flock and bash Cryptic, something that I find distasteful. For whatever faults Cryptic has (and I've certainly been a part of pointing them out on the forums here), I don't run around spreading hate. I'd compare this particular article to hate propaganda.

(And oops... wall of text :P )

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 06:14 PM
It's a free country - everyone is entitled to their opinion. :)

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 06:50 PM
Its all good for cryptic. I'm sure cryptic gets more traffic on days massively slams them. I'm a prime example. I wouldn't have given this site a second thought today if not for the massively article.

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 06:59 PM
I like Ten Ton Hammer a lot. I like that they have special pages for each MMO.

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 09:07 PM
Read the following signature. They advertised them. Congrats to them for doing the ironic actions FOR Cryptic. :rolleyes:

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 10:18 PM
I like Ten Ton Hammer a lot. I like that they have special pages for each MMO.

I am sorry but TTH is extremely biased from what I have seen.

I think you have got it wrong. There has been lots of time in that I have questioned Massively's unbiased stance regarding Cryptic. Seraphina defended them a lot, so did Kyle Horner. The readers at massively sometimes get angry with the amount of Cryptic entrys that are put in. Massively as an organization has tried their level best to be really nice to Cryptic, and give them the benefit of doubt a lot of times. It has always been the readers.

I do not know if you guys are aware, but Cryptic is one of the most controvertial companies outside this forum. People either hate them or really like them. And they really do hate the company. There have been reason in the past for the hate. Hell, I like where CO is going right now, but this is not a AAA title. But that is ok. Not everyone can be the best. If the people playing are happy with the product then by all means go ahead.

The problem arises when the people who like the game and are willing to pay for the game are just not enough for the company and new players are hard to come by because of some PR blunders in the past. That is the problem. Sorry for going off on a tangent like that.

But overall, I think Massively has been having a love affair with Cryptic. I follow those guys and they always say really nice things about Cryptic and that ****es the readership because a large portion of them cannot stand the guts of Cryptic.

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 11:16 PM
It's a free country, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. I've had PLENTY of criticism for Cryptic when I've felt they deserved it. I convinced a group of folks elsewhere to quit, and then convinced most of them to join back up, and added some new blood through more than a dozen invites when I felt things had changed. Right now, I support the direction CO and Cryptic are headed in. I think that Atari is sort of like a shark in deep waters, ever present and poised to strike when I least expect it, but Cryptic can't really do much about that except show them the censored-storm that happens when their financial meddling goes too far.

And everybody's got a quarterly to think about, that's a no brainer.

Massively has written positive and negative articles. I've usually felt both were deserved. They are under no obligation to paint Cryptic in the most positive light, and what would you call what happened when Vibora was announced as pay? I think "frothing rage" is a fairly G-rated descriptor, personally. ;) Ancient history it ain't, that was like a month ago or less wasn't it?

Archived Post
03-18-2010, 11:51 PM
Did Cryptic / Atari do something to directly annoy Massively.com...?
I've noticed quite a few rather anti-Cryptic (company and games) articles lately from more than one writer on that site. And it's tied to the Joystiq family of websites (although Joystiq is not exactly the greatest gaming info source but they're still very well known).

For Cryptic, including this recent one titled:
The Daily Grind: What do you think of Cryptic?
http://www.massively.com/2010/03/18/the-daily-grind-what-do-you-think-of-cryptic/

Maybe I'm taking it the wrong way, but it's kind of a loaded question to put up as the article title...? Seems like it's trying to attract flames / hate.

(Also check out that close up picture of Bill Roper on the top bar there... kind of unflattering to say the least).

Not exactly the greatest press the game can receive........

There are many staff at massively admitted personal friends of Daeke (who is no longer with Cryptic - as to why he left, neither side would comment beyond Daeke, who at the time confirmed "I'm no longer with Cryptic"; and the Cryptic company post of "Daeke has left the employment of Cryptic, and we wish him well in his future endeavours"); and Massively is also less of a MMO News site, and more of a MMO 'tablloid' type site, more often then not posting the MMO rumors without first doing any real fact checking.

I mean hell, Funcom' history has been WAY more 'spotted' than Cryptic's (and Anarchy Online is STILL the worst launch of any MMO to date - with Age of Conan having only a slightly better launch than AO did); and STO's launch overall was actually pretty solid as MMO launches go; yet here is Massively wanting to rake Cryptic 'over the coals' again.

As to the 'perks/discounts/etc.' fo new players, hell, again, Funcom did IMO WORSE in that regard by offering new and former players 'perks' (a nice free in game mount and some other items) to return to/join AoC; while those who had stuck with the game got nothing at all for their 'loyalty' - Funcom's reply to those players: "Well, you can always purchase another copy of the game, and a second account....

IMO - Cryptic is FAR from the most controvertial or 'hated MMO developer out there (SOE still leads in that department, and probably will for some time). My take is that Cryptc is more 'High {pofile' with STO and CO BOTH getting major content added rather quickly - (CoX and Paragon USED to be in the running with quck and somewhat substantial free updates, but IMO - since issue 13 and their mishandling of the 'Mission Architect'; they have really fallen behind the curve in this regatrd, and Going Rogue is behind schedule; and even the CoX faithful are disheartened that the Dev team has not said all that much new bout GR as the GR closed beta nears it's start) - so becuse (currently) Cryptic has:

1) A new game
2) A fair amount of new content for each beinf released soon.
3) Established a timeline for continued new content for BOTH MMOs.
4) A VERY talkative (imo a GOO thing) Dev staff.

The Massively tabloid machine has a lot of grist for their 'mill' when it comes to Cryptic.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 04:39 AM
It was the Daeke thing. You could spot the moment Massively went from defending Cryptic to attacking them. It's been getting worse, and frankly, the lack of professionalism is starting to tarnish my opinion of the site. There's nothing wrong with them having an opinion, but there is a difference between stating an opinion and dwelling on it, having it affect the quality and content of everything you write.

Massively's podcast is generally more upbeat and positive.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 04:47 AM
I think the article in the OP is largely neutral. They're just reporting the state of some opinions gathered elsewhere, and give some positive and negative statments before asking for opinions.

If anything their article is a little misleading because the image presented has what appears to be a team.

If they were being accurate they'd make that image a 1/10th thumbnail and place it next to a standard size image of a hero playing solo, because if you're enjoying CO content there's only a 10% chance you're in a team.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 06:12 AM
It was the Daeke thing. You could spot the moment Massively went from defending Cryptic to attacking them. It's been getting worse, and frankly, the lack of professionalism is starting to tarnish my opinion of the site. There's nothing wrong with them having an opinion, but there is a difference between stating an opinion and dwelling on it, having it affect the quality and content of everything you write.

Massively's podcast is generally more upbeat and positive.

Wait so when they were biased and praising everything you were ok, now that they are not, you have a problem?

And this article was not even negative, this was just asking for opinions of the readers on how they felt about Cryptic. And if you read the comments, you will figure out that a lot of people do not share your love for the company.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 06:18 AM
Pretty much MMORPG is the bottom of the barrel for places to go. There is so much negativity and Trolling going on there its not even funny. I noticed within the last couple of years. Now its starting to spread to the people that run it. The owners need to start laying a heavy hand down or they (the writers) will run it into the ground.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 09:21 AM
Wait so when they were biased and praising everything you were ok, now that they are not, you have a problem?

And this article was not even negative, this was just asking for opinions of the readers on how they felt about Cryptic. And if you read the comments, you will figure out that a lot of people do not share your love for the company.
Massively's defense of Cryptic was never more than half-hearted in the first place. And at least I could read an article about a different game without a sideways complaint against STO or CO. I play a lot of MMOs and I like a lot of them for different reasons. So when I'm reading something about LotRO, I'd like it to be about LotRO and not be peppered with petty whining about Cryptic. It's off topic and unprofessional. I don't have to be a Cryptic fanboy to find that behavior annoying.

And Massively KNOWS what people's opinion on Cryptic are. Try reading the comments to any Cryptic-related article for four pages of angry ranting. It makes the discussion boards at MMORPG.com look civil and reasoned by comparison. Why would they ask a question they obvious know the answer to? That we ALL know the answer to? This article was posted on March 18th and has 70-something comments - just TWO DAYS after the CO state of the game news posting about Roper stepping down as head with 64 comments (average comment count? 5).

Massively is trolling. Plain and simple.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 10:46 AM
Massively's defense of Cryptic was never more than half-hearted in the first place. And at least I could read an article about a different game without a sideways complaint against STO or CO. I play a lot of MMOs and I like a lot of them for different reasons. So when I'm reading something about LotRO, I'd like it to be about LotRO and not be peppered with petty whining about Cryptic. It's off topic and unprofessional. I don't have to be a Cryptic fanboy to find that behavior annoying.

And Massively KNOWS what people's opinion on Cryptic are. Try reading the comments to any Cryptic-related article for four pages of angry ranting. It makes the discussion boards at MMORPG.com look civil and reasoned by comparison. Why would they ask a question they obvious know the answer to? That we ALL know the answer to? This article was posted on March 18th and has 70-something comments - just TWO DAYS after the CO state of the game news posting about Roper stepping down as head with 64 comments (average comment count? 5).

Massively is trolling. Plain and simple.

It is extremely funny that I could not look at Massively's website without something leaning Cryptics way. It is good we agree that they were biased to begin with.

Cryptic is not exactly a company that a site would like to defend against a readership that hates it. Cryptic has given a lot of reason for that opinion. But you are right in the fact that they knew what the opinion was. And I am sorry but I am yet to read a single article on there that has anything negative to say about Cryptic. But you know what, I like massively taking a much more neutral view of the company now than before when they had a love affair with it. I know you do not agree, but I do.

But then again I do not feel the need to defend Massively at all. You can feel like they are trolling and stuff, but at the end of the day an extremely large portion of the people out these forums do not like Cryptic in the least bit. And again I will say that there is good reason for that.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 11:23 AM
Nevermind, it's not even worth it.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 11:53 AM
It is extremely funny that I could not look at Massively's website without something leaning Cryptics way. It is good we agree that they were biased to begin with.

Cryptic is not exactly a company that a site would like to defend against a readership that hates it. Cryptic has given a lot of reason for that opinion. But you are right in the fact that they knew what the opinion was. And I am sorry but I am yet to read a single article on there that has anything negative to say about Cryptic. But you know what, I like massively taking a much more neutral view of the company now than before when they had a love affair with it. I know you do not agree, but I do.

But then again I do not feel the need to defend Massively at all. You can feel like they are trolling and stuff, but at the end of the day an extremely large portion of the people out these forums do not like Cryptic in the least bit. And again I will say that there is good reason for that.

Most of the hate comes from people that have never actually played Champions or Star Trek Online and just bashing to bash based on hear-say. Hell many people still here continue to spout out the wrong belief and reason why Daeke left. Yet, I still follow Daeke, I've yet to see in his blog or his tweets anything negative about Cryptic yet. It seems funny, and silly, that the only people being negative about the whole thing, especially for an individual that this community bashed regularly (don't even try to deny that) is the few who often made Daeke's life Hell here.

Also it's funny that some of the same comments get made, like nickling and diming, and since this is typically only spouted by two posters on this forum, I can already guess who the handle belongs to there on that site, but it's funny how they easily ignore all the other game companies attmepts at "nickling and diming". *shrugs*

I've never really read too deeply on these website articles. They get a lot of information wrong on a regular basis. Though news is good, it's only good when it's actual correct and factual information, not hearsay which, unfortunately, many of these game report sites are doing lately. Just posting hearsay.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 12:02 PM
To be honest, Daeke never really impressed me all that much. He did a decent job but not extraordinary. I don't know why people are so bent out of shape about it.

But on topic, I also never really understand all the Cryptic bashing that people love to do. I know I'm a forgiving guy but they haven't done anything I can see a reason for.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 12:10 PM
But on topic, I also never really understand all the Cryptic bashing that people love to do. I know I'm a forgiving guy but they haven't done anything I can see a reason for.
Games are just something you have an opinion on. You can like it or not. It's just there. But a service is something that you can resent. A MMO is both a game and a service, and game flaws become service flaws and vice versa. The ability for a MMO to maintain a playerbase and not commit some perceived unforgivable sin upon someone, somewhere is impossible. And that someone complains loudly. A company which has more than one MMO has all those sins compounded upon them. Ten years ago in a different game under a different publisher, somebody lost two days of progress due to a bug and he never forgot and never will forget.

MMO players are special. I've never seen a community of people so filled with resentment and hate over the very thing which brings them all together. There's no such thing as a perfect MMO, but by golly, anything less is a slap in the face or something.

Cryptic isn't any worse or better than any other company out there. It's just that they make MMOs. Worse yet, they make more than one.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 03:46 PM
There's no such thing as a perfect MMO, but by golly, anything less is a slap in the face or something.

Cryptic isn't any worse or better than any other company out there. It's just that they make MMOs. Worse yet, they make more than one.

I agree with most of your post. Just two things.

First - some one just won a bet :D I wonder who it was. You are the first to say slap in the face :D had to say this.

Second - I am sorry but Cryptic is not as good as the rest. Turbine, CCP, Blizzard to name a few are much better than Cryptic, both from the service point and game point. Now I think what they are doing with CO right now is taking it in the right direction. They are doing everything right. From taking Roper away from the public eye (it does not matter if he is to blame for anything, people simply do not like him and to have him in the public eye was hurting them a bit), to the renewed communication effort. They are doing a brilliant job right now. But they already have the bad press.

But Cryptic being a so-so company is not a bad thing. Not everyone can be at the top. Cryptic makes lite MMOs, and really casual MMOs. Nothing wrong with that, as there is an audience for that.

I am just sad that they most likely have D&D Forgotten Realms license. I would have liked Turbine to get that one, if for no other reason than the look of that universe would be ruined in my eyes if the same engine as STO and CO were used. But that is just my opinion.

Archived Post
03-19-2010, 04:43 PM
Massively has a regular feature called One Shot (http://www.massively.com/category/one-shots/), where they share user submitted screenshots. Nearly all the screenshots in this feature portray their subject game in a good light, and most all of the writeups are also positive. The most recent for CO is called One Shot: Ewww (http://www.massively.com/2010/03/11/one-shots-ewwww/).

Don of the dead found this toilet on one of the smokestacks in Millennium City Westside. Guess now we know where all that brown smog comes from.

If your goal was to create the most unattractive portrayal of CO as could possibly fit this One Shot feature, you could hardly do better. Here they are taking aim at STO in One Shot: Meteors Galore (http://www.massively.com/2010/03/16/one-shots-meteors-galore/).

It seems like no matter where players fly in Star Trek Online, there are meteors all over the place. We're not entirely sure what left so much intergalactic litter all over the place -- perhaps one too many space fights?

I went through the last few dozen postings in this One Shot category and could not find anything comparably negative about other games. On the first page we see positive shots for ********, LotRO, EVE, Fallen Earth, Mortal, etc.

Why would they ask a question they obvious know the answer to? That we ALL know the answer to? This article was posted on March 18th and has 70-something comments - just TWO DAYS after the CO state of the game news posting about Roper stepping down as head with 64 comments (average comment count? 5).

Massively is trolling. Plain and simple.

Good eye for calling it what it is.

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 09:33 AM
Most of the hate comes from people that have never actually played Champions or Star Trek Online and just bashing to bash based on hear-say. Hell many people still here continue to spout out the wrong belief and reason why Daeke left. Yet, I still follow Daeke, I've yet to see in his blog or his tweets anything negative about Cryptic yet. It seems funny, and silly, that the only people being negative about the whole thing, especially for an individual that this community bashed regularly (don't even try to deny that) is the few who often made Daeke's life Hell here.



Not sure if you've ever been fired from a high profile job before but...

1) You don't say anything negative till you get all your severance/benefits.
2) You more than likely have a clause saying you can't reveal certain information for x amount of time.
3) Bash your old company publicly and you will never work in that industry again.

So would Daeke or anyone else shown the door say anything negative about his company? Probably not. Course, he may really not have anything negative to say. Only Daeke knows.

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 09:39 AM
Not sure if you've ever been fired from a high profile job before but...

1) You don't say anything negative till you get all your severance/benefits.
2) You more than likely have a clause saying you can't reveal certain information for x amount of time.
3) Bash your old company publicly and you will never work in that industry again.

So would Daeke or anyone else shown the door say anything negative about his company? Probably not. Course, he may really not have anything negative to say. Only Daeke knows.

And the conspiracy theories are rampant and for this reason. Honestly, has anyone actually followed and listened to Daeke? When Cryptic announced that Revelations was free, Daeke trumpetted it on his blog. Seriously, some people look for any excuse to hate, and even if I was fired with a gag order clause on me, I certainly wouldn't trumpet the fact the company I formerly worked for did something, especially since the playerbase still assumes he was fired for stating it was paid for to begin with.

So far, all the conspiracy theories about Daeke leaving do not match up at all.

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 09:49 AM
And the conspiracy theories are rampant and for this reason. Honestly, has anyone actually followed and listened to Daeke? When Cryptic announced that Revelations was free, Daeke trumpeted it on his blog. Seriously, some people look for any excuse to hate, and even if I was fired with a gag order clause on me, I certainly wouldn't trumpet the fact the company I formerly worked for did something, especially since the player base still assumes he was fired for stating it was paid for to begin with.

So far, all the conspiracy theories about Daeke leaving do not match up at all.

He Was East Coast big Culture and even Tax and rental market shock..too.. He was a nice enough young man and adequately covered the departure of Dear Fer ..IRon Angel to another role.. So too He had a charm on line and was trying to hold COS events or things that just one person is hard pressed to do.. A for effort B- for execution. The Fate Comply notes there to say he was anything more then human..

PM or public chat I cant recall once he blew wind up my skirt.. it was my fault for not making his job easier with a tile banner for cos cons.. yet he leave a good memory if albeit brief.. I dont think he ever stole the bosses parking spot..

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 10:52 AM
I honestly have no idea what you just said Senshi.

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 11:33 AM
And the conspiracy theories are rampant and for this reason. Honestly, has anyone actually followed and listened to Daeke? When Cryptic announced that Revelations was free, Daeke trumpetted it on his blog. Seriously, some people look for any excuse to hate, and even if I was fired with a gag order clause on me, I certainly wouldn't trumpet the fact the company I formerly worked for did something, especially since the playerbase still assumes he was fired for stating it was paid for to begin with.

So far, all the conspiracy theories about Daeke leaving do not match up at all.

Silverspar is definetly right about one thing. People ALWAYS find an excuse to hate (most of them end up on my ignore list)

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 05:47 PM
He came here along way from home..
Liked the Time we had with him then he went away..
Simple.

No great mystery those things happen..









or maybe he realized Manny Ramirez was a Dodger and.. ah never mind

Archived Post
03-20-2010, 06:20 PM
He came here along way from home..
Liked the Time we had with him then he went away..
Simple.

No great mystery those things happen..









or maybe he realized Manny Ramirez was a Dodger and.. ah never mind

Quoted for...WTF?

Archived Post
03-21-2010, 08:51 AM
Did Cryptic / Atari do something to directly annoy Massively.com...?
I've noticed quite a few rather anti-Cryptic (company and games) articles lately from more than one writer on that site. And it's tied to the Joystiq family of websites (although Joystiq is not exactly the greatest gaming info source but they're still very well known).

For Cryptic, including this recent one titled:
The Daily Grind: What do you think of Cryptic?
http://www.massively.com/2010/03/18/the-daily-grind-what-do-you-think-of-cryptic/

Maybe I'm taking it the wrong way, but it's kind of a loaded question to put up as the article title...? Seems like it's trying to attract flames / hate.

(Also check out that close up picture of Bill Roper on the top bar there... kind of unflattering to say the least).

Not exactly the greatest press the game can receive........

Uh, this was hardly a 'man' article. Massively pointed out areas where customer's weren't happy and then asked what people who read their site think. Don't be a fan boy.

Also, Joystiq is awesome.

Archived Post
03-21-2010, 12:51 PM
Exactly.. MAssively smashivly... don't care seldom read them... Internets what it is..
I like Atari they were one of the first ,an American Company..
Doesn't matter if they are more active in daily affairs.. They didn buy in here to stop a product from competing with one of their more favoured ones.. Like others have to avoid competition in the industry.

Cant favour MAssively for exclusives its a big marketing plan....

Archived Post
03-21-2010, 03:42 PM
i never look at website reviews, the magazine i get every month and some specific magazines i sometimes buy are way more reliable.
they don't have any influence and actually play the game it self, talk about how they feel about the game and pointing out the good and bad parts.
that's something they should do, using gossip and bringing back historical mistakes is nothing short from sad.
if they want to keep there reputation high, they should stop being armatures.(or kids for that matter)

Archived Post
03-25-2010, 02:43 PM
I've stopped visiting Massively, I don't mind the tabloid and rumor posting as sometimes those rumors are based on fact, one of the reasons why I used to read wowinsider when I played ********.

I'm just sick of all the third rate MMO's that Massively posts about, alot of grindfest asian mmos get articles and I don't understand why they get so much attention. I've tried a number of them, free or paid, both are just trash.

I'd rather a focus on higher quality titles.

Archived Post
03-25-2010, 07:53 PM
Well you all can stop hating them they gave a complete regular columb to Massively.

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03-29-2010, 05:18 PM
Wow, I just noticed this thread. Hopefully it's not too much of a necro.

Massively (http://www.massively.com) doesn't hate Cryptic. We have quite a few staff members that play STO, and a few of us play CO. Kyle and I are the main CO players right now but a lot of us dabble.

The main thing with Massively is that we are really pushing to get the actual news out, and not just push PR for a company. Reporting for news means we have to hit the good as well as the bad stuff.

The main point behind that episode of The Daily Grind (http://massively.com/category/the-daily-grind) is that Cryptic is a really controversial company right now. No bad intentions were meant by it, honest.

And obviously, we have both my column, Behind the Mask (http://massively.com/category/behind-the-mask) as well as our STO column Captain's Log (http://massively.com/category/captains-log) written by Ryan. Really, we like Cryptic's games and we like talking about them. That's all.

Archived Post
03-30-2010, 07:17 PM
Not to cast doubt on the situation, but after the last several months of articles written by Massively, including perpetuating a rumor that neither side has given a clear cut answer on, attacking Cryptic on numerous occassions, in fact several articles inflating some problems and painting them as if Cryptic was the only company that did anything like it and many other myriad things, it's kind of hard to beleive any statement made that Massively doesn't wish ill on Cryptic in the slightest.

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03-30-2010, 08:51 PM
Not to cast doubt on the situation, but after the last several months of articles written by Massively, including perpetuating a rumor that neither side has given a clear cut answer on, attacking Cryptic on numerous occassions, in fact several articles inflating some problems and painting them as if Cryptic was the only company that did anything like it and many other myriad things, it's kind of hard to beleive any statement made that Massively doesn't wish ill on Cryptic in the slightest.

I am sorry Silverspar, but you would hate anything that tries to say anything negative about Cryptic or CO. I am avid reader of Masssively and trust me, they are far from blaming CO or Cryptic. If you could point towards those inconsistencies then I would be more inclined to believe you.

Sera and Kyle both had nothing but love for Cryptic. They have had that love affair with Cryptic since CO was nearing launch. They have been biased towards Cryptic, but in a positive way. The readers, most of them, hate the guts out of Cryptic, and I really cannot blame them much. Cryptic is getting better, but that does not forgive their past.

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03-30-2010, 09:42 PM
Seems your point of view is based on a bias point as well. I've also taken the time to read many of the comments from the Massively readers and many of them have admitted that they've never played a single one of Cryptics games, basing all their points of view on hearsay.

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03-30-2010, 10:24 PM
Your objection is that the readers who leave comments haven't played?

How is that Massively's fault?

You're extraordinarily pro-Cryptic and I think that colors your view. I don't see anything out of the ordinary for gaming journalism, such as it is, in how Massively treats Cryptic. It is true that they are a controversial company (perhaps unfairly; Atari is, in my view, the source of the controversial elements, but Cryptic is now paired with them for better or for worse).

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03-30-2010, 10:38 PM
Actually, I was making a comment based on what the previous poster claimed. You can make the claim I am pro-Cryptic all you want, but considering you are coming out and defending Massively in such claims kind of throws you into a similar camp.

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03-31-2010, 03:19 AM
I just don't see the bias that some of you do. I see different writers having different opinions of a product/company. :eek: Imagine that!!! People on the internet publicly posting their opinions!

Double :eek:

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03-31-2010, 04:32 AM
Actually, I was making a comment based on what the previous poster claimed. You can make the claim I am pro-Cryptic all you want, but considering you are coming out and defending Massively in such claims kind of throws you into a similar camp.

Your logic, it does not follow.

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03-31-2010, 04:46 AM
Not to cast doubt on the situation, but after the last several months of articles written by Massively, including perpetuating a rumor that neither side has given a clear cut answer on, attacking Cryptic on numerous occassions, in fact several articles inflating some problems and painting them as if Cryptic was the only company that did anything like it and many other myriad things, it's kind of hard to beleive any statement made that Massively doesn't wish ill on Cryptic in the slightest.

MMORPG pretty much is the bottom of the barrel. I don't expect to much when I go over there. There is way to much trolling/hating going on there. Which is the reason why I left.

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03-31-2010, 06:43 AM
MMORPG pretty much is the bottom of the barrel. I don't expect to much when I go over there. There is way to much trolling/hating going on there. Which is the reason why I left.

Quoted for Emphasis.

Not only that, but the crowd that regularly visits, posts, and votes on MMORPG.com considers EVE Online to be the apex of all MMO gaming. That was enough to sour my opinion of MMORPG.com, but what makes me utterly disregard any voting poll or opinion (good or bad) that comes out of there is that they generally hate on any and all games that they feel deviate too much from what appeals to "hardcore" MMORPG players (ie games like EVE Online, Lord of the Rings Online, and Vanguard which pretty much force you to group and grind for long hours to get anywhere). I simply don't have the time or inclination to play games like those.

Now I only visit the site to read articles about upcoming games I'm interested in (like APB, which will no doubt get slammed for being too casual-friendly).

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03-31-2010, 08:20 AM
Your logic, it does not follow.

I'm sorry I've confused you because you want to not read anything else I wrote and decide because I pointed out the flaws in a websites "objective" reporting I am always pro-Cryptic on everything they say and do.

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03-31-2010, 08:26 AM
I meant it literally, your last few responses have essentially been non-sequiturs, opportunities for you to opine in one way or another but not related in any clear manner to the posts you were quoting. Or, you put forward a proposition that isn't supported by anything.

I don't mind that you carry a torch for Cryptic. I think they have a lot of really good ideas, personally. But when your beef with Massively is that the people leaving comments on articles seem not to like Cryptic, and that somehow makes Massively biased, well, that's just poor reasoning. Ever read the comments section of major newspapers' online articles? Do you think the New York Times is a far-right rag? A lot of the comments could have been posts on FreeRepublic.com any time there's an opportunity to get in political jabs, but it doesn't speak to the intent of the paper itself. They're just comments. Anyone can comment. You're only justified in suggesting that particular commentators appear to have a bias against Cryptic, you can't logically use that as evidence that the writers at Massively do.

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03-31-2010, 09:25 AM
Seems your point of view is based on a bias point as well. I've also taken the time to read many of the comments from the Massively readers and many of them have admitted that they've never played a single one of Cryptics games, basing all their points of view on hearsay.

Again I will ask you to point out where they were biased negatively towards Cryptic. Where you stated that they gave half truths and what not. And you are so blatantly pro-cryptic that for you even legitimate concerns and real negative sides of Cryptic are the best things to happen to the world.

And as I have said, people do not like Cryptic, why? There are a number of reasons. They do not like a company that has low amount of content to begin with (admitted by the devs), and they want to charge for more content. I would not like that company either. I don't want to get into the others.

As for me defending Massively, I do not care one way or the other. They are not my fave website or anything. I do not like some of their write-ups concerning Cryptic, because they defend Cryptic too much just like you.

Lastly, complaining that the readers have not played the game is extremely irrelevant. You can like it or you can hate it, but the popular opinion outside your bubble is that Cryptic is not that good of a company.

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03-31-2010, 09:33 AM
This thread is just full of fail.

Reall guys just let it die.

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03-31-2010, 11:28 AM
Yeah i hate to say it but none of you are going to agree with each other about this, we can see this because this has gone on for 5 pages and its still not over. i think we should just end this before you start hating each other